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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 12:03:34 PM
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manda59
Posts: 8726
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bricole77
This is what I was referring to in my op. Praying alone together. Thank you!
bricole, that's what I always assumed you meant in the OP.
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 12:54:59 PM
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herestoresmysoul
Posts: 2131
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bricole77
I think there are other ways to see if someone bears fruit in their life than just praying with them.
Ask them to tell you their testimony, about their relationship with God, do they attend church, do daily devotions? Are they active in any ministries?
I do think you can tell an awful lot from regularly praying with someone . The Bible does tell us to pray constantly so to pray with a close friend is surely good? I cant see what harm it could do and it would keep you both focused on God as well as each other.
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 1:34:54 PM
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rawr.ben
Posts: 2517
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Elena1030
"The 'let's be prayer partners' approach sounds sweet and spiritual on the surface, but it can actually be used as a form of manipulation. Praying is one of the most intimate experiences you can ever have. Consider the fact that when you pray with someone you hardly know, you are encouraging a bond that can be more intense than even physical affection or sex. There is a fine line between spirituality and sexuality, and people who do not respect the line are in danger of getting burned."
Emphasis mine.
CAN be manipulative . . . Yeah, I guess, if you are, well . . . a crummy person who would use prayer as a means of manipulating circumstances . . . but that's pretty sickening.
quote:
The writers go on to give an example scenario of a first date, during which the guy and gal are talking in his car, parked at her apartment complex. The date is about to end. Here's how they describe the next events: "After a while you [the gal] get out of the car, and instead of trying to hug you or kiss you, he says, 'Let's pray and thank the Lord for our day.' Well, you are absolutely shocked. Not only is he not trying to put a move on you, he is taking the spiritual lead by initiating prayer. Here's where it gets dangerous. Once you start to pray together, you are combining two of the most powerful forces on the planet: your spiritual drive and your sex drive. It's so easy for the two to get convoluted and for you to finish the prayer session with a divine word from God that this is The One. In fact, all that you really achieved was a spiritualization of the hormones. Take it slow with prayer. There will be plenty of time down the road to pray together. Don't mess it up before your relationship has a chance to grow."*
I'll be honest . . . . that sounds like a whole lot of baloney to me.
Basically, what this just said is, "If you pray together, you're just going to become horny."
My goodness.
quote:
I discovered a similar truth about doing Bible reading and discussion together at an early (it was VERY early) stage in dating ---> my dating companion (we never did get to official boyfriend/girlfriend stage) and I were going over Scripture, reading it together, and cuddling. At least we were in a public place, which limited the emotional & physical/sexual temptations. But those were still there. If we had had just an intellectual discussion, rather than an affection-filled one, with consulting the Bible for our talking points or supporting evidence (as part of the discussion) instead of reading it devotionally (as in, devotion to each other -- that was the tone and the feeling), then the experience would not have been out of proportion to where we were in the stages of dating.
That's not a "truth" per se. It was for you, specifically. But it is not universal.
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rawr.ben
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 1:57:34 PM
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Sideways
Posts: 3522
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Well, you might not want to spend hours and hours alone with a person, but I still content that praying together before marriage is the wiser course of action. It's just one piece of the puzzle, in my opinion.
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 2:07:34 PM
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rawr.ben
Posts: 2517
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sideways
Well, you might not want to spend hours and hours alone with a person, but I still content that praying together before marriage is the wiser course of action. It's just one piece of the puzzle, in my opinion.
Hours? Yeah, that would be excessive. And I just don't have that many words to pray!
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rawr.ben
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 2:59:43 PM
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SamsonUSA
Posts: 2116
Joined: 10/5/2008
From: Laguna Beach. Presently an Arizona desert dweller
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They were continually devoting themselves to the apostles' teaching and to fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer.
Acts 2:42
But we will devote ourselves to prayer and to the ministry of the word." Acts 6:4
And when he realized this, he went to the house of Mary, the mother of John who was also called Mark, where many were gathered together and were praying. Acts 12:12
The context of the passage implies there were woman present. ( They were at Mary's house) Does it imply that all of the "many" were married?
When he had said these things, he knelt down and prayed with them all Acts 20:36
Praying before God is part of our personal daily devotion and prayer is also a vehicle through which we worship Him.
Would those who would hesitate to come before the Lord together in prayer with someone whom they are dating refrain from attending a church service with them also?
_____________________________
"The notion that we should conduct our lives completely apart from the admonitions of God's Word is a terrible notion. To read Scripture, but refuse to allow its commands to influence one's conduct, is the essence of sin." - John Frame
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 3:11:39 PM
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manda59
Posts: 8726
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SamsonUSA
Would those who would hesitate to come before the Lord together in prayer with someone whom they are dating refrain from attending a church service with them also?
A one-on-one and a congregational setting are two totally different situations.
_____________________________
"I really, really like this. Five stars!", Sideways March 2010
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 3:21:20 PM
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SamsonUSA
Posts: 2116
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quote:
A one-on-one and a congregational setting are two totally different situations.
Using this reasoning then perhaps the dating duo should also refrain from giving thanks by saying grace when sitting down to enjoy a meal together.
_____________________________
"The notion that we should conduct our lives completely apart from the admonitions of God's Word is a terrible notion. To read Scripture, but refuse to allow its commands to influence one's conduct, is the essence of sin." - John Frame
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 4:33:22 PM
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stellaluna
Posts: 4212
Joined: 4/11/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
quote:
ORIGINAL: birdiewatcher
my boyfriend never prayed with me at all. then he became my husband and never prayed with me. i would have rather found out while we were dating that he wasn't going to be the spiritual leader.
This is sort of what I was thinking. We get many women on thie forum and another forum I go to whose marriages are bad and they often say "well he SAID he was a Christian" If more couples prayed togather maybe each would have more idea where the other was spiritually,
My husband and I prayed togather loads and loads of times before we were married. I cant actually see what is wrong with it. Why is it any different from speaking to each other, except that you are both sepaking to God?
Prayer is a relationship and I feel needs to be shared long before Marriage. Just my opinion.
At what point in your relationship did you start praying together?
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 5:37:46 PM
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jhuperetes
Posts: 1566
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I think this is an odd one. I had a few thoughts run through my block, in no particular order...
"Religiosity" or "legalism" in disguise?
The concern with praying together is not because of "spiritual" bonding, but because of an emotional one. When I pray, I may feel the need to pray about something very personal. It requires some trust to make such prayer front of someone else. With trust we form bonds - but they are not spiritual, per se. It should not be, as prayer is communicating to my Master, not with the other person kneeling next to me.
Another thought was how in the world is my "sex drive" gets involved in "let's pray and thank the Lord for our day", from that author???
Befuddlement as far what is "permitted and what is not" (which sets off my legalism alarms instantly). Allowed to study the Bible, but not pray together. Can attend church and discuss the sermon, but not pray together. Can have theological discourse but no prayer together. Eh???
I pray before each meal. I also try to remember to pray after each meal (how easy is to forget with a full belly!). Is that spiritual bonding? (By the way, I can get people to bond better after a nice meal than prayer. Try to explain that away.)
At what point my praying creates spiritual bonding? I pray throughout the day. I pray in my inner voice, pretty much throughout the day.
Would silent prayer be ok? If so, then it maybe an indication that is emotional, not spiritual.
I understand the concerns about being alone gives temptation to having sex. But, we are talking about two adults who seem to have self control, as they are praying together - not playing spin the bottle! If we are so scared they will instantly start inappropriateness after reading Numbers, maybe we should pump them full of libido suppression drugs!
I see the concern with younger, unwise, and spiritually immature individuals.
I just don't see anything scripturally... I understand. Not everything that is permissible is beneficial. But, is prayer, communicating with my Master, ever not beneficial?
Otherwise I am ok. Thank you. The side effects will wear off.
< Message edited by jhuperetes -- 11/14/2009 6:10:29 PM >
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 6:48:57 PM
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dnp200450
Posts: 606
Joined: 5/30/2009
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jhuperetes
I think this is an odd one. I had a few thoughts run through my block, in no particular order...
"Religiosity" or "legalism" in disguise?
The concern with praying together is not because of "spiritual" bonding, but because of an emotional one. When I pray, I may feel the need to pray about something very personal. It requires some trust to make such prayer front of someone else. With trust we form bonds - but they are not spiritual, per se. It should not be, as prayer is communicating to my Master, not with the other person kneeling next to me.
Another thought was how in the world is my "sex drive" gets involved in "let's pray and thank the Lord for our day", from that author???
Befuddlement as far what is "permitted and what is not" (which sets off my legalism alarms instantly). Allowed to study the Bible, but not pray together. Can attend church and discuss the sermon, but not pray together. Can have theological discourse but no prayer together. Eh???
I pray before each meal. I also try to remember to pray after each meal (how easy is to forget with a full belly!). Is that spiritual bonding? (By the way, I can get people to bond better after a nice meal than prayer. Try to explain that away.)
At what point my praying creates spiritual bonding? I pray throughout the day. I pray in my inner voice, pretty much throughout the day.
Would silent prayer be ok? If so, then it maybe an indication that is emotional, not spiritual.
I understand the concerns about being alone gives temptation to having sex. But, we are talking about two adults who seem to have self control, as they are praying together - not playing spin the bottle! If we are so scared they will instantly start inappropriateness after reading Numbers, maybe we should pump them full of libido suppression drugs!
I see the concern with younger, unwise, and spiritually immature individuals.
I just don't see anything scripturally... I understand. Not everything that is permissible is beneficial. But, is prayer, communicating with my Master, ever not beneficial?
Otherwise I am ok. Thank you. The side effects will wear off.
jhuperetes, I couldn't have written this any better myself! I have been looking over this thread in silence over the last few days and I have to admit I am a little taking back at some of the responses I have seen. Ironically, I don't see Christian lust (whatever that is) as the problem. I see fear, a great deal of fear.
Dating should be a positive time in a persons life. If I feel sexual while praying with someone, trust me, I will terminate the relationship immediately-forever! Not only that, I will stay away from all women and commit myself to some form of psychiatric hospital and volunteer for chemical libido separation! Then I will register myself on a sex offender list.
If you really want to have tight control of the problem one has too:
A) Have males and females seated on separate sides of the church with a separator between them.
B) Forbid males and females from associating in public places unchaperoned.
C) End dating/courting and switch to pre-arranged marriages.
D) End co-education, separate male and female schooling.
E) Forbid women from serving in the United States Military.
F) Only allow same gender medical care unless there is an extreme emergency.
I could go on and on but I think I have made my point. I know I do not want to live in Saudi Arabia!!!
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 7:43:04 PM
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kohls356
Posts: 681
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I find it creepy and ick actually that author would equate praying and becoming sexual as the same. If one is sincerely praying, thinking about sex would be the last thing on their mind.
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 9:23:38 PM
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stellaluna
Posts: 4212
Joined: 4/11/2005
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I don't think sex is even a consideration. I see it as a mixing of emotion and your prayer life with someone you barely know. If someone is your boyfriend or girlfriend, that is not a committed relationship IMO. Once you start working toward marriage--and are moving into engagement--that's different. Pray together all you want as you begin embarking on a life together. Before that, pray for and about the person, not necessarily with.
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 9:25:10 PM
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dnp200450
Posts: 606
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kohls356
I find it creepy and ick actually that author would equate praying and becoming sexual as the same. If one is sincerely praying, thinking about sex would be the last thing on their mind.
I would think so too! I feel sorry for Christians trying to find each other through such mutual fear and mistrust. No wonder their are so many single believers out there. Nowadays you can't even pray together without being looked on with suspicion 
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 9:40:53 PM
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manda59
Posts: 8726
Joined: 9/22/2005
From: Hampshire, UK
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quote:
ORIGINAL: stellaluna
I don't think sex is even a consideration. I see it as a mixing of emotion and your prayer life with someone you barely know. If someone is your boyfriend or girlfriend, that is not a committed relationship IMO. Once you start working toward marriage--and are moving into engagement--that's different. Pray together all you want as you begin embarking on a life together. Before that, pray for and about the person, not necessarily with.
stella is absolutely spot-on here.
_____________________________
"I really, really like this. Five stars!", Sideways March 2010
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 9:50:06 PM
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rawr.ben
Posts: 2517
Joined: 5/16/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: stellaluna
I don't think sex is even a consideration. I see it as a mixing of emotion and your prayer life with someone you barely know. If someone is your boyfriend or girlfriend, that is not a committed relationship IMO. Once you start working toward marriage--and are moving into engagement--that's different. Pray together all you want as you begin embarking on a life together. Before that, pray for and about the person, not necessarily with.
Can I pray with my other friends? Guy friends? A mentor?
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rawr.ben
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 10:09:07 PM
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herestoresmysoul
Posts: 2131
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quote:
ORIGINAL: stellaluna
quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
quote:
ORIGINAL: birdiewatcher
my boyfriend never prayed with me at all. then he became my husband and never prayed with me. i would have rather found out while we were dating that he wasn't going to be the spiritual leader.
This is sort of what I was thinking. We get many women on thie forum and another forum I go to whose marriages are bad and they often say "well he SAID he was a Christian" If more couples prayed togather maybe each would have more idea where the other was spiritually,
My husband and I prayed togather loads and loads of times before we were married. I cant actually see what is wrong with it. Why is it any different from speaking to each other, except that you are both sepaking to God?
Prayer is a relationship and I feel needs to be shared long before Marriage. Just my opinion.
At what point in your relationship did you start praying together?
AS far as I remember it was within the first couple of weeks. However you have to remember that I knew within a week that he was the man I would marry,and we were really close from the start, but for us prayer together was really important.
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/14/2009 11:44:09 PM
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bricole77
Posts: 358
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From: Grand Haven, MI
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To Ben, dnp, kohls and jhuperetes:
I was never saying praying with someone makes you want to jump into bed with them. Or saying you should not pray in group settings, at church co ed or with members of the same sex. I was referring to couples in romantic relationships praying alone together. Again not saying this gives you any sort of sexual desire but will cause a bond to form. jamie and jhuperetes point out this is an emotional bond not spriritual but maybe then we are in agreement that one does form!
So when that bond forms during prayer maybe it can be confusing and blind the person to whats going on in their relationship with the other. or the person could end up seeking God for the sole purpose of strengthening their relationship with their mate.
jhuperetes you said you "see the concern with younger, unwise, and spiritually immature individuals" and maybe that is just the case then.
I welcome the differing opinions on this thread and I thank all of you for posting here!
_____________________________
~*britanni *~
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/15/2009 11:58:58 AM
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AndersFan
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I'm in the "don't pray together" camp. But I also think it's a matter of personal preference rather than a biblical mandate either direction.
I used to always want to pray with those I was dating. But because of personal experiences, I changed my mind. I almost married a guy I dated a few years back. He was about to propose to me when he changed his mind without warning and left, never to speak to me or see me again. No matter what, it would have been devastating. But because he had a spiritual leader role in our relationship, we prayed together every day, studied the Bible together almost daily, went to church together... It messed up my spiritual walk too.
So as for the praying thing, it's a personal preference. Personally, I know that I could not handle that, so I prefer not to pray together. Others, however, could handle it just fine, so I say more power to them.  Obviously mine is an isolated incident that doesn't happen often. 
My sister has been married more than a decade to a very godly man, and he purposefully chose for them not to pray together for all the reasons listed in this thread. I thought that was pretty cool. 
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RE: Praying with your boyfriend/girlfriend - 11/16/2009 11:11:53 AM
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DaveW
Posts: 3959
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: MD suburbs of Washington DC
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bricole77
My Pastor talks about how in the old Jewish marriage ceromonies they would place the joppa (sp?) over the bed to consummate the marriage. the same joppa the couple would be married under. then a spiritual interchange would take place when the two united and "became one flesh" i believe a spritual interchange similar to this takes place when you pray with someone. again just my opinion dont have specific bilical reference. Joppa? It took me a couple of readings before I realized what you were refering to. I am surprised how badly some words can be mispronounced.
The term is Chuppah, which is a wedding canopy. the Ch is pronounced like the ch in Bach. It is a gutteral that is close to the K sound.
The chuppah is mentioned prominately in the marriage codes and blessings from the first century. Current practice is to use a Tallit, a rectangular prayer shawl with ceremonial fringes on the 4 corners (translated "hem" in the NT), worn during morning prayers by observant Jewish men. In fact, my son's tallit just came in the mail this last friday. He is getting married on Dec 20 and wanted a big tallit for use as the chuppah.
I have read a lot about the first century marriage customs in Jerusalem and the surrounding area, and of the diasporah Jews living in Greece. I have also heard some wild claims by christian preachers that I have found absolutely no support for. This would fall into that category.
However, I CAN tell you personally and subjectively that when I have cast my own tallit over someone, or even loaned it to them to use, that I have sensed a responsibility toward that person to pray for them. It is my custom that at the final blessing that closes our service (the Aaronic benediction) that I cover my wife (and previously my children) with it.
It is true that praying together brings spiritual closeness. That is a GOOD thing. Paul says we are a body, with all the various members bound together with sinues of love. Please note that he follows 1 Cor 12 which talks about the body with 1 Cor 13, the love chapter. We should never seek to be seperated spiritually from any of our brothers or sisters.
While it is true that in some cases, praying together has led to inappropriate behavior up to and including adultery, I would submit that it is more a result of our western mentality that seperates us all out, and then have difficulty handling it when the Lord brings us together. We do not know how to handle the closeness and act in an inappropriate or sinful way.
Better, IMO, to get used to dealing with the closeness and openness. Being closed off like that does not promote congregational unity and function together as the body.
_____________________________
Avatar is my son Caleb and Leah on their wedding 12/20/09
We are now empty nesters.......
====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
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