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Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/11/2009 9:35:04 PM
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Nate79
Posts: 249
Joined: 8/26/2007
From: Midwest USA
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This quandary has puzzled and frustrated me to no end. I’ve read several excellent books on the subject, but I still feel like I’m mostly clueless. For Men Only by Jeff and Shaunti Feldhahn is a great book, as are the books by Emerson Eggerichs and I have tried to internalize their wisdom. However, the way I think is fundamentally different than the way my wife thinks. I have tried desperately to figure out my bride’s mind but I feel like I’m just as ignorant as when I started! Well, perhaps not quite that bad, but I certainly feel like a novice in understanding what she is thinking, why, and what my response should be. Perhaps even that approach is wrong headed? What I’m getting at is I’m told that a solution oriented direction will only further frustrate and/or hurt a woman if she is upset about something. If that is the case, is approaching this whole subject in what I see is a logical, fact-finding mission off base?
The responses I usually get when I’ve asked this question in the past are snickers from the ladies and understanding sighs from the men. The ladies essentially tell me there is no way to understand … because they don’t understand themselves in those situations. So what’s a man to do? The last thing I want to do is hurt my wife further when she’s already hurting. Yet that seems to be what I do nearly every time. I believe that my solution presented is what she needs, yet she tells me she needs me to listen and be quiet. But I’ve tried that and if I don’t say anything, then I feel like I’m being insensitive by not offering what I see as a course of action that would help. I’ve tried quietly listening, repeating back to her what I think she’s feeling, but if I offer a solution at the end, it still ends up all wrong. So apparently my approach still feels wrong to my bride.
The flip side is that when I have an off day and I’m grumpy or whatever, I’m expected to just snap out of it … and criticism will follow if I don’t. It seems she demands understanding, yet is willing to give none to me if I’m the one that’s going off on a tangent. Of course things go downhill if I point out this double standard. What gives ladies?
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/11/2009 9:50:08 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3177
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: being knit together in my mother's womb
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 You're great, Nate! No debate!
I am not a typical woman. In fact, I know few who are "typical women!" But I will answer you as though you were my husband, asking the same things.
I do not talk to my husband in order to have him attempt to solve the subject of my conversation. In this case, I would be talking to him in order to speak to someone about the issue, because being able to voice it helps me to come to a conclusion and a solution. I do not want him to attempt to solve my problems, because he has NO idea what all the nuances of the problems are. He wants to state a quickly-thought-out solution; I want to consider all the possibilities and come to a conclusion that takes care of most if not all of the facets.
Do I understand myself? I most certainly do. But as I wrote, sometimes, I need to hear it "out loud" in order to come to that conclusion.
Indeed! Be quiet and listen! Too often, we feel like we are treated like children who need an "adult" to come up with the answers! That is not the case. I have a real hard time thinking that every time a man opens his mouth to another man, it is so that the other man will solve the problem he is talking about. Don't you guys talk about a certain issue, expecting the other person to just hear you out? Do you always want someone telling you what to do? And I am asking because I don't know the answer. I just cannot imagine that this is something only women do.
And I have no idea about your final paragraph. I sure hope I don't do that to my husband. Perhaps you need to talk about it, to see if she can hear you out without telling you what to do to solve your own problem with this. I would bet she will apologize and be more careful.
_____________________________
While in prayer or praise, I am only as devoted to G-d as I am in my most private moments.
Abiyah, if you had known them as G-d knows them, you would have answered them differently.
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/11/2009 11:55:34 PM
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deermousie
Posts: 2209
Joined: 9/26/2007
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If it's any consolation, we don't understand you men, either. What's the deal with explosions and the remote???
Talk, talk, talk. Keep communication going. Learn from each other and help each other.
Yeah, when I have a problem, I don't want a cold solution from my husband, I want warm sympathy. And if my husband is sick or injured, I'm going to want to feed him chicken soup. So talk to your bride: what does she want? Tell her what you want.
When people are unkind or take advantage of each other (read: sin against each other), then it ratchets the misunderstanding up several notches on purpose for their own selfish reasons, and the poor second person is really lost. Then it's not really a matter of not understanding, but of someone deliberately hurting another and blaming it on the differences between the sexes. It's lying to do that, it's taking advantage of another to do that, it's sin to do that.
_____________________________
"Through Gates of Splendor" by Elizabeth Elliot
"Federal Husband" by Doug Wilson
www.biblegateway.com for online concordance (I use it daily)
"Passion and Purity" by Elizabeth Elliot
And I think chickens are really funny
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/12/2009 12:07:45 AM
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myhusbandswife76
Posts: 229
Joined: 4/24/2009
Status: online
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quote:
the way I think is fundamentally different than the way my wife thinks.
This sums it up. I don't think that it's possible to understand how the opposite gender thinks because our brains are wired diffrentlly. We can learn to communicate better, and more effectivlly but we won't understand each other's thinking.
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/12/2009 4:07:14 AM
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herestoresmysoul
Posts: 1453
Joined: 3/13/2009
Status: online
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Usually what women want is for you to listen and validate their feelings not to offer solutions.
As for your last paragraph, I do actually know a few women who expect the world from their husbands but arent prepared to give in return. They are called takers and not givers. They want all of their needs met but arent prepared to meet their husband needs.
Try both writing down how you each feel and share what you have written with no judgements or criticism. We have been taught to do this on a marriage enrichment weekend and it is really good for each to have their feelings and thoughts listened to and validated.
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/12/2009 11:35:24 AM
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moon_mouse
Posts: 435
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Nate79
I believe that my solution presented is what she needs, yet she tells me she needs me to listen and be quiet. But I’ve tried that and if I don’t say anything, then I feel like I’m being insensitive by not offering what I see as a course of action that would help. I’ve tried quietly listening, repeating back to her what I think she’s feeling, but if I offer a solution at the end, it still ends up all wrong.
Then don't offer a solution until she asks for your opinion on a solution. She seems to be pretty clear about what she's looking for from you (sympathetic listening), so how can you be insensitive if you are providing what she has said she needs? Offering solutions when she's told you that's not what she needs implies that she doesn't know what she needs, and that you know better what she needs, and that is insensitive (and as others have pointed out, potentially insulting). If you feel you need to say something, you might try what I've heard called "mirroring", making observational statements like "that must have been very frustrating" or "it must have hurt to hear her say that". This allows her to investigate her own feelings and thoughts, and if you give her the chance to do that, you might find that she arrives at the same solution that you were thinking of in the first place.
quote:
The flip side is that when I have an off day and I’m grumpy or whatever, I’m expected to just snap out of it … and criticism will follow if I don’t. It seems she demands understanding, yet is willing to give none to me if I’m the one that’s going off on a tangent. Of course things go downhill if I point out this double standard. What gives ladies?
Well, you can only control your own behavior in this situation, and I would (gently) ask you to look at your behavior when you're having a bad day. Do you admit that you are frustrated and having a bad day, or do you just grouse? Are you snappish at her when you are really frustrated at someone or something else? My DH gets like that sometimes, and when he does, he tells me and takes some time by himself. Usually. Sometimes he acts like a bear, and doesn't want to talk about it, and I just refuse to be the target of his anger. I'll accept him absenting himself from my company for a while, but there is no excuse for rude behavior.
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/13/2009 5:32:13 AM
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cindybode
Posts: 913
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Northwest PA
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YOU are commanded to live with your wife in an understanding way. God would not tell you to do something that's impossible.
So, start working on understanding.
What do you need from me right now?
How can I bless you today?
Do you need me to just listen, or are you looking for a solution?
So what I'm hearing you say is, when I do ___, it makes you feel ___.
Those are good things to start with. Build from there.
< Message edited by cindybode -- 10/13/2009 5:51:22 AM >
_____________________________
If you lock in any creature, from rats to chickens to pigs to people, 10 to 30 or more in a box and force feed them you'll create little monsters. Confinement Education School Operations (CESOs) just don't compare to naturally pastured free-ranged kids.
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/15/2009 10:52:32 AM
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anne-girl
Posts: 1087
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Wherever I am
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quote:
The last thing I want to do is hurt my wife further when she’s already hurting. Yet that seems to be what I do nearly every time. I believe that my solution presented is what she needs, yet she tells me she needs me to listen and be quiet. But I’ve tried that and if I don’t say anything, then I feel like I’m being insensitive by not offering what I see as a course of action that would help. I’ve tried quietly listening, repeating back to her what I think she’s feeling, but if I offer a solution at the end, it still ends up all wrong. So apparently my approach still feels wrong to my bride.
You're doing well with the second bit, right up until you get to the solution part. If you feel like you're not saying enough when you're just listening, try rephrasing back to her, and summarizing, what she's saying. If that still doesn't feel like enough, ask questions, but story-expanding questions, not leading questions. Ie "how did you feel when she said that?" or "why do you think he would have done that?", rather than "what if you did such-and-such?" If she says she doesn't want a solution, just don't give her one. Period. If she says she doesn't know what to do, even then, ask her if she just wants you to listen or if she offers a solution. If you must tell her what you think, stick to reflecting what she says eg "I think this must have been a difficult situation for you" etc.
quote:
The flip side is that when I have an off day and I’m grumpy or whatever, I’m expected to just snap out of it … and criticism will follow if I don’t. It seems she demands understanding, yet is willing to give none to me if I’m the one that’s going off on a tangent. Of course things go downhill if I point out this double standard. What gives ladies?
I'm not sure what gives as I am not your wife  but I'd agree that you do need to discuss this. The best time to talk about this scenario is not when you're in a grumpy mood. I'd suggest bringing it up several days later, and find a time to tell her that you were hurt on the other day when you felt as though she expected you to be more cheerful. Stick to "I felt this way" statements rather than "you did this" statements--she can argue the facts but she can hardly tell you that you don't feel what you feel! Ask her if there was a more effective way you could have communicated with her at the time; also ask if she is having any trouble discerning when you're out of sorts. That should be enough to get the ball rolling. The key is to start the conversation when you're not in a mood that might make her feel hurt or defensive.
If there's an Alpha Marriage course in your area, I can't recommend it highly enough. There was, among other things, an excellent session on communication. All the how-to-communicate rules just seemed like a lot of silly mumbo-jumbo until we tried it; then all of a sudden, by following those rules we could discuss contentious issues without getting upset. We took it as newlyweds, and while I'm sure we would have made it through without the course  I believe it saved us a huge amount of heartache.
_____________________________
"Mine?"
~Finding Nemo
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/15/2009 11:10:02 AM
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Auben
Posts: 1147
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: Where pines tower and cranberries float
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Hmmm...I think all people think differently. We can understand how they work, even if we don't understand the why exactly. (For instance, we might not understand why someone has a fear of heights because we don't have a fear of heights but we can understand that not all fears are rational, and we can accept the other person and be compassionate to them.)
As for your wife, I think the other ladies have it covered. Now is a good time to find out what your wife needs from you. If she wants you to listen and sympathize then do that. If what you're doing isn't working, ask her what you can do. If that doesn't work (she doesn't know) try little things: holding her, discussing with her, etc. until you find something that does work and then remember that for next time.
As for your last paragraph I don't understand the double standard (perhaps you didn't write it all out?). Is she cranky with you and insistent on you listening and understanding her anger but when you're upset she won't listen? I'm trying to figure this out because trying to talk to someone isn't generally the same thing as someone being in a cranky mood (although both may require understanding its not quite the same thing).
_____________________________
Tamara
~Everywhere is walking distance if you have the time~
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RE: Is is possible to understand how your wife thinks? - 10/18/2009 9:31:52 PM
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Nate79
Posts: 249
Joined: 8/26/2007
From: Midwest USA
Status: offline
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Covaan_Meshuga: You mentioned feeling treated like a child who needed an adult to come up with the answer. My wife felt exactly that, though my intentions we so far from that. When she stated it like that, it helped me see my “solutions” in a different light.
Deermousie: Explosions and the remote? Hmmm, for myself, it goes back to the fact that most little boys want to be soldier and/or the hero. Making things blow up and saving the day is a secret dream of most men I think. Mostly the hero aspect though. We want to save the day for the woman we love. Warm sympathy is a great description, that helps. That’s what I want to communicate to my bride when she’s upset or hurting.
Moonmouse: I have to admit that when I’m frustrated about something else that I can be a bear at times. My wife will usually ask me why I’m grumpy and I’ll explain. Usually I’ll usually snap out of it after a bit but sometimes I need time outside working in the garage or on the lawn to decompress.
Car2ner: I’m not sure if she’s read For Women Only, but she has some similar books.
Everyone else that mentioned mirroring:
This last week she sent me a couple emails from work expressing frustration about something involving a friend of hers. I finally succeeded in just mirroring her feelings and acknowledging what she felt and she actually thanked me for it. So she must have felt a difference! It felt like I was leaving something out and I felt almost inadequate when sending the email, but it was what she needed. As a result of this, when I was frustrated over something this week, she listened and didn’t criticize. Amazing how this works!
Cindybode: Good reminder on what the Lord requires of me. I want to fulfill that, but sometimes the how, the practical of what ways to accomplish that escape me. Hence this thread to receive some feedback on practical ways to do so.
I just don’t have more time at the moment to respond more, but thanks to everyone who responded!
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