The Presidential Speech

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sylvan -> The Presidential Speech (9/24/2008 9:17:12 PM)
Watching that speech on the economic situation was like watching a crooked car salesman trying to sell an old Ford Pinto. Awesome speech!!!!!! But hey, 50% of folks believe it. LOL.

deliveredarling -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/24/2008 10:14:58 PM)
Ya'll are going to think I am nuttier than a fruitcake by saying this... I think this thing was planned! Bush said (and I will paraphrase) that Paulson and Bernanke had been discussing a plan before we the bailout proposition. They produced a proposal way too fast. What better way to control the public than through FEAR, just like the did after 911. That was when we saw our constitutional rights begin disappearing. We had better watch this one close cause I think we are headed for more troubles than just a financial fallout.

Zhi -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/24/2008 10:30:34 PM)
My husband's comment was "Let me know when the stuff the pundits have been talking about for the entire week is done being regurgitated, and then let's watch the new Knight Rider". I concur. shrug

csl7037 -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/24/2008 10:37:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: deliveredarling Ya'll are going to think I am nuttier than a fruitcake by saying this... I think this thing was planned! Bush said (and I will paraphrase) that Paulson and Bernanke had been discussing a plan before we the bailout proposition. They produced a proposal way too fast. What better way to control the public than through FEAR, just like the did after 911. That was when we saw our constitutional rights begin disappearing. We had better watch this one close cause I think we are headed for more troubles than just a financial fallout. It's not like no one saw this coming. I'm sure they had a whole file drawer full of plans and contingencies for when this all hit the fan. What I heard of the President's brief address sounded like "Mortgage Crisis for Dummies" or "What happens when a bunch of greedy people get too much credit" - it was very elementary but something I know half this country doesn't comprehend. Most aren't sitting around listening to pundits like we are (and they're probably sleeping better at night in their ignorant bliss). Hopefully some people understand a little better now. Now that it may be too late.

sylvan -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/24/2008 10:41:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Zhi My husband's comment was "Let me know when the stuff the pundits have been talking about for the entire week is done being regurgitated, and then let's watch the new Knight Rider". I concur. shrug I love "trickle up" economics. It worked exactly the same post-Reagan. The sad part is, there is a large portion of the public that just doesn't care - they're too busy being right, instead of seeing facts.

leonfigg3 -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/24/2008 10:43:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: deliveredarling Ya'll are going to think I am nuttier than a fruitcake by saying this... I think this thing was planned! Bush said (and I will paraphrase) that Paulson and Bernanke had been discussing a plan before we the bailout proposition. They produced a proposal way too fast. What better way to control the public than through FEAR, just like the did after 911. That was when we saw our constitutional rights begin disappearing. We had better watch this one close cause I think we are headed for more troubles than just a financial fallout. deliveredarling, I hope you do not take my comment too personally, or seiously, but I must say that anymore comments like this one and the moderators may consider puting this thread in Conspiracy Central.

sylvan -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/24/2008 11:12:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: leonfigg3 quote: ORIGINAL: deliveredarling Ya'll are going to think I am nuttier than a fruitcake by saying this... I think this thing was planned! Bush said (and I will paraphrase) that Paulson and Bernanke had been discussing a plan before we the bailout proposition. They produced a proposal way too fast. What better way to control the public than through FEAR, just like the did after 911. That was when we saw our constitutional rights begin disappearing. We had better watch this one close cause I think we are headed for more troubles than just a financial fallout. deliveredarling, I hope you do not take my comment too personally, or seiously, but I must say that anymore comments like this one and the moderators may consider puting this thread in Conspiracy Central. Well, it sure isn't extreme ignorance - a lot of average people (not in the "inner loop") predicted this many years ago. You know what those people were called?? "Conspiracy Theorists". But they were right - in fact this played out just like it did under Bush I when taxpayers spent around 2 trillion in bailouts. Yet, you're saying NOBODY on the upper tier could have forseen this?? Really now!?....talk about faulty logic. Yeah, Bush's fear/desperation angle was despicable. The funny thing is, people are so blindly partisan that they would vote for him again!!! LOL.

Zhi -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/24/2008 11:22:31 PM)
quote: I love "trickle up" economics. It worked exactly the same post-Reagan. The sad part is, there is a large portion of the public that just doesn't care - they're too busy being right, instead of seeing facts. Well, we'd already heard it all. Repeatedly. From people who are much better at economics than Bush. And we will hear it all again, dissecting the speech, from people who are much better at economics than Bush, all weekend. Can you blame us for wanting to skip the middle man?

mapachito13 -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 12:33:33 AM)
How come a problem that was years in the making has to have the lawmakers vote NOW for the bailout. If I was about to plunk down 700 billion, I want to make sure we did it right not just fast! It makes me wonder what other ramifications this bill has other than the bailout. But it will cost millions of jobs so vote yes now! Having the federal government as the owner (lienholder) of a slew of properties just doesn't sit right with me. What's more socialistic than the government owning your home? I don't want them as my landlord!

TaoPoohBear -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 1:09:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mapachito13 How come a problem that was years in the making has to have the lawmakers vote NOW for the bailout. If I was about to plunk down 700 billion, I want to make sure we did it right not just fast! It makes me wonder what other ramifications this bill has other than the bailout. There's a few wise folks that agree with you - As economists, we want to express to Congress our great concern......

stamper_ben -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 8:07:40 AM)
I say give every man and woman over the age of 18 that 700 billion. That works out to about 350,000 per couple. Then let the banks that can't manage themselves fail. With the money we get we won't need loans, right? Oh, and I sure am comforted by the fact that Chris Dodd, the Senate Banking Committee chair has received over 13 million in contributions from the banking industry. Link here. Who's gonna be in charge of where the bailout money goes?[8\|]

Dubya -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 8:45:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stamper_ben I say give every man and woman over the age of 18 that 700 billion. That works out to about 350,000 per couple. Then let the banks that can't manage themselves fail. With the money we get we won't need loans, right? Oh, and I sure am comforted by the fact that Chris Dodd, the Senate Banking Committee chair has received over 13 million in contributions from the banking industry. Link here. Who's gonna be in charge of where the bailout money goes?[8\|] Sorry Ben but I think you need a new calculator. I may not know the exact number of people over 18 but I think 200 million is a good guess. 700 Billion divided by 200 million is $3500... NOT $350,000.

DanJames -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 8:59:24 AM)
If this was planned, then it was planned by republicans trying to make democrats look really stupid by not fixing all the things that the dems broke. This all started during the Bill Clinton era when they forced banks to give mortgages to people that couldn't afford a home. Unemployment benefits as income? Gimme a break.

stamper_ben -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 9:04:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Dubya quote: ORIGINAL: stamper_ben I say give every man and woman over the age of 18 that 700 billion. That works out to about 350,000 per couple. Then let the banks that can't manage themselves fail. With the money we get we won't need loans, right? Oh, and I sure am comforted by the fact that Chris Dodd, the Senate Banking Committee chair has received over 13 million in contributions from the banking industry. Link here. Who's gonna be in charge of where the bailout money goes?[8\|] Sorry Ben but I think you need a new calculator. I may not know the exact number of people over 18 but I think 200 million is a good guess. 700 Billion divided by 200 million is $3500... NOT $350,000. I'll be the first to admit it... Math is not my strong suit.[:)]But at $7,000 per couple, that would still be a much better incentive than the $1200 we previously got to stave off a recession.[8\|] Again I ask, exactly WHO is gonna be in charge of coming up with a plan for the bank bailout? Chris Dodd, or the banking lobbyists who gave him $13 million?

cog41 -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 9:40:32 AM)
quote: a lot of average people (not in the "inner loop") predicted this many years ago Yep. Deep down most everyone believed this was coming. No one party or banker(s) is to blame. We've been allowing this to go on and refused to change things by the ballot box and pursuing diligant accountability of those elected. Now after the eventual period of economic pain and suffering we must demand ethical/moral accountability of those in the business/banker world and a return to our constitutional form of govt.. Physically if need be. Otherwise we can expect to be force fed a complete socialist system.

TaoPoohBear -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 9:50:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sylvan Watching that speech on the economic situation was like watching a crooked car salesman trying to sell an old Ford Pinto. Awesome speech!!!!!! But hey, 50% of folks believe it. LOL. Got a better take on it - Tom Toles

letusreason -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 10:08:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: deliveredarling Ya'll are going to think I am nuttier than a fruitcake by saying this... I think this thing was planned! Bush said (and I will paraphrase) that Paulson and Bernanke had been discussing a plan before we the bailout proposition. They produced a proposal way too fast. What better way to control the public than through FEAR, just like the did after 911. That was when we saw our constitutional rights begin disappearing. We had better watch this one close cause I think we are headed for more troubles than just a financial fallout. no no not nutty at all, after all...Pearl Harbor was planned by FDR, Lyndon Johnson planned the Kennedy assination, the jews planned 9/11, and this bail out now, every thing was planned yep yep!! Except the moon walk, that wasn't planned, that was fake. You are way ahead of us on this for sure. I'm assuming you are the other 50% right?

Zhi -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 11:37:57 AM)
Considering that this possibility should have been obvious to anyone with half a brain in the general public at least a year ago, I would be far more concerned if they HADN'T started planning something a while ago. This is the government. Making contingency plans for wild improbabilities, much less probable scenarios, is kind of the whole job of their advisers.

joy2give2u -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 1:12:08 PM)
quote: What I heard of the President's brief address sounded like "Mortgage Crisis for Dummies" or "What happens when a bunch of greedy people get too much credit I for one am glad I watched his speech even if it was mortgage crises for dummies..........this dummy had no clue what was going on and why so many people were panicking. I think I have a better understanding of what happened now and am glad........(I don't watch TV nor do I have time to read much about it online so most of my information was hear say at work) The thing I don't understand and would like opinions on.........I am not sure this is the right thread so if it is not please redirect me to the best place to post my questions. Pres. Bush stated the our system was not functioning correctly because of greed and unwise choices.......from what I gathered our system is based on credit.......and we are in this problem today because we are a society based on credit. How is a society based on credit a healthy one ever? Doesn't the bible say that the debtor is slave to the debt holder? I guess I am wondering, even if it is horrible for us for years to come, if it might not be better to let the system collapse and fall apart........so that our society can go back to a cash based economy.....wouldn't it be better to face it now and leave something better then an econony which functions on enslaving people?

leonfigg3 -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 6:05:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: joy2give2u Pres. Bush stated the our system was not functioning correctly because of greed and unwise choices.......from what I gathered our system is based on credit.......and we are in this problem today because we are a society based on credit. How is a society based on credit a healthy one ever? Doesn't the bible say that the debtor is slave to the debt holder? I guess I am wondering, even if it is horrible for us for years to come, if it might not be better to let the system collapse and fall apart........so that our society can go back to a cash based economy.....wouldn't it be better to face it now and leave something better then an econony which functions on enslaving people? joy2give2u, To my knowledge, a society based on credit has never worked. It has never survived. The problem that once the people and the government gets it into their head that they have no choice, it's too late to do anything about it. I think there is a great fear out there that it really isn't a matter of how our country is going to ultimately experience another 1929 style financial collapse, but when. And when it does happen it is going to be far greater than 1929 because there will be absolutely no way for us to get out of it. For myself I am beginning to feel that what is going on is just the beginning of such a collapse. The signs are mounting one right after another. The politicians know who really is at fault, who has fostered the notion that individuals, and countries could live on credit. They are. We all are. Though I would like to point fingers at a particular political party, I know I can not. As my Conservative grandfather used to say, the politicians know what they need tell us, and what they to do, but they also know that if they told us what we needed to hear-the truth- and did what they knew they had to do, they would never get elected. Somewhere in the last fifty or so years, this world, especialy our counttry, crossed a line as far as the importance we have put on materialism. We have come to accept credit as a way of life because we have come to veiw materialism as a necessity and a right, regardless of one's ability to eventually pay for their "stuff". This "bail out" may slow the collapse, but it will not stop it. In fact, it may very well create more problems and make recovery even more difficult. The fact that we are looking to the very people who got us into this mess, to get us out of it, is proof of that. The fact that we feel that throwing more money at the situation is going to correct the situation is proof of that. Maybe it is time for God to slap us along side the head, again, and once again show us that money and stuff is not the answer. Then again, who really knows what is going on because I have also heard that the financial problems we are experiencing are mainly centered in a relative small portion of financial institutions throughout the country.

joy2give2u -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/25/2008 6:18:34 PM)
Leonfigg3 thank you for your reply. It was excellent and has given me much to think and pray about. Maybe God is saying to us, to those who have ears to hear, how very important it is to get out of debt and stop leaning on credit as a way of life. I know for me your post was a confirmation of what God has been saying to me the past month. Thank you again for posting.

walkin2e -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/29/2008 7:58:55 AM)
I watched President Bush's speech with a friend of mine. The whole time he was "speechifying", there was a sound in the background that sounded like a bunch of hogs grunting around the feed trough. At first, I thought I was hearing things, but my friend also made the same comment about the pigs. We turned to every network that was broadcasting the speech, and the sound of hogs was heard on every channel. When I heard this, I immediately thought of the word GREED. Did anyone else hear this? walkin2e 1 Timothy 6 v 10 "For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through many sorrows."

mapachito13 -> RE: The Presidential Speech (9/29/2008 8:22:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TaoPoohBear quote: ORIGINAL: sylvan Watching that speech on the economic situation was like watching a crooked car salesman trying to sell an old Ford Pinto. Awesome speech!!!!!! But hey, 50% of folks believe it. LOL. Got a better take on it - Tom Toles It's just like the old joke "How can you tell a politician is lying?" The more I hear them talk about it, the more I think we should let the banks fail and "let the market sort it out". Anyone with accounts under $100,000 will get their insured money back. And as the S & L crisis showed the government makes sure those with more than $100k will get it back as well. The other stonger banks will pick up these deposits giving them more capital to loan more money. Those that were ready to retire and found their savings disappear due to the implosion of the stock market have my sympathies. I am sure they would be the ones who lost the most and may not be able to wait for the market to rebound to regain their share value. I am a scientist not an economist therefore I have not studied the ways of money as closely as some others but I am amazed at how people put real money into an account and because of its drop in value, this real money disappears like a magic trick. Even though the "value" of the shares drop, where does the money go?

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