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ORIGINAL: stamper_ben

Look at the response to hurricane Ike. It finished its destruction and was headed north Saturday afternoon. On Sunday the WalMart near me was open and supplying food, propane and batteries. FEMA was no where to be seen.

Now, I have to get to work on time. Where's the non-existent train station?

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Communism, FASCISM and NAZISM all share a common heritage, socialism. Each of these movements declared that the well being of the people could only be achieved by socialist ideals and regulating industry to the point where it could not function freely. So, Mussolini nationalized the railroads and the trains ran on time.. for a while.

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ORIGINAL: csl7037

Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it.

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ORIGINAL: TMeeks

In pre-war Germany, two great forces fought for control of Germany... Communism and NAZISM. In Italy, the same thing happened. But, this time it was FASCISM vs. Communism.

What most have failed to appreciate is that each was a side of the same coin. And, the real battle that got lost in the fray between the socialist factions was that for economic freedom and limited government.

Communism, FASCISM and NAZISM all share a common heritage, socialism. Each of these movements declared that the well being of the people could only be achieved by socialist ideals and regulating industry to the point where it could not function freely. So, Mussolini nationalized the railroads and the trains ran on time.. for a while.

The allure of Hitler and Mussolini, like Lenin before them was that they promised 'common folk' a piece of the pie by taking from the rich, which in Germany's case was said to be the Jews, and giving that wealth to "the people'.

Today, after years of educational control by the left of the 60's, the country seems poised to be ready to embrace socialism without really understanding that it IS socialism. Like the Germans and the Italians about 50% of our populace seem to think that the government's job is to take care of them. Where that money is suppose to come from and how much freedom will be lost in the process simply doesn't cross their minds.

As I have written a bit before, I have a copy of a magazine, published in 1917, that waxes eloquent about how Lenin and company have finally given democracy to the Russian people. In hindsight that article appears absurdly naive and patently wrong. Just the opposite happened. And, today, less than 100 years later the Russian people find themselves a country run as a criminal enterprise of thugs and bullies.

Did ANY of these people, Germans... Italians... Russians, realize what their leaders of 'Change' were about to bring upon their heads. No. And, as I speak with young to middle aged young people I find that they don't even question the long term wisdom of policies that have never really been fully voiced by the one in which they are putting their trust. They only know that this charasmatic leader is going to give them healthcare, free education and trains that run on time.

I understand the allure of socialism. But, it's sad to see it... Because, the outcome has been proven over and over again when enough time has passed.

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ORIGINAL: huangshan

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ORIGINAL: csl7037

Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it.

Given the poor historical analysis at the start of the thread, what does that say about the people furiously nodding at it?

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ORIGINAL: TMeeks
As I have written a bit before, I have a copy of a magazine, published in 1917, that waxes eloquent about how Lenin and company have finally given democracy to the Russian people. In hindsight that article appears absurdly naive and patently wrong. Just the opposite happened. And, today, less than 100 years later the Russian people find themselves a country run as a criminal enterprise of thugs and bullies.

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Obama believes in communism and it didn't work in the past, it won't work now.

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ORIGINAL: csl7037

Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it.

It's just about unbearable to watch what's unfolding in our country right now. Even if we narrowly escape the worst case scenario in the upcoming election, it's a much bigger issue and the tide will not be turned so easily, if it can be at all.

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ORIGINAL: rlj

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Communism, FASCISM and NAZISM all share a common heritage, socialism. Each of these movements declared that the well being of the people could only be achieved by socialist ideals and regulating industry to the point where it could not function freely. So, Mussolini nationalized the railroads and the trains ran on time.. for a while.

Actually business was privately owned in Nazi Germany as opposed to publicly owned such as in the Soviet Union. This is why for example that private German Companies have to deal with backlash from some of their wartime activities. The government's involvement in the companies was mainly to provide them with slave labor.

While there was a socialistic side to the Nazi's this was strangled out and Hitler would have none of it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: huangshan

quote:

ORIGINAL: csl7037

Those who do not study history are doomed to repeat it.

Given the poor historical analysis at the start of the thread, what does that say about the people furiously nodding at it?

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ORIGINAL: litfire2000

much of what you say is true...Nazi is compound of two German words National Socialiste (sp)...or National Socialist ...Hitler did believe in government control of everything, but not necessarily ownership...the slave labor was paid labor but, the company did not pay the laborer, it paid the government

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ORIGINAL: todd_t

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Obama believes in communism and it didn't work in the past, it won't work now.

For the most part, China is probably the exception to communism working on a large scale - even though they are heavily capitalist as well.

As for Obama being a closet communist, give me a break. That Red Scare garbage played itself out of town years and years ago.

quote:

ORIGINAL: csl7037

If you study history, you find that nations really do have a national "personality" - I think that's why communism seems to "work" (in a way) in China. And the Russians have their own unique personality. I had a Russian Studies professor in college who was convinced back in about 1991 that Russia would have another czar within five years. That didn't really happen - but their version of "democracy" is unique, to say the least. They still submit to the corrupt thugs in charge as if to royalty in a way that is incomprensible to us in the US.

My concern is that I see the "personality" of the US being lost. The value of the American worker that McCain has been talking about, I fear, is really a thing of the past. I see the determination and drive and "grit" that has gotten this country to this point as a thing of the past or at least something of the minority now. I am really afraid where this road we're on will take us.

People that say Obama is not heading us down a road toward Socialism don't understand that, while he may not look exactly like Stalin or Marx, it is an American Version of Socialism - a subtle version that, I fear, could be more insidious.

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From 1933 to 1935 the democratic structure of Germany was replaced with a completely centralized state. The autonomy previously exercised in many matters by the provincial governments was eliminated, and these subnational governments were transformed into strictly controlled instruments of the central government. The Reichstag retained only a ceremonial, not a legislative, function. By a process of coordination (Gleichschaltung), all private organizations of business, labor, and agriculture, as well as education and culture, were subjected to party control and direction. Even the Protestant church was infiltrated by National Socialist doctrines. Special legislation excluded Jews from the protection of German law."

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None of the contemporary economic analyses of privatization takes into account an
important, earlier case: the privatization policy implemented by the National Socialist (Nazi)
Party in Germany. The modern literature on privatization, the recent literature on the twentiethcentury
German economy (e.g. Braun, 2003) and the history of Germany’s publicly owned
enterprises (e.g. Wengenroth, 2000) all ignore this early privatization experience. Some authors
occasionally mention the re-privatization of banks but make no further comment or analysis (e.g.
Barkai, 1990, p. 216; James, 1995, p. 291). Other works, like Hardach (1980, p. 66) and
Buchheim and Scherner (2005, p. 17), mention the sale of State-owned firms in Nazi Germany
only to support the idea that the Nazi government opposed widespread state ownership of firms
and do not carry out any analysis of these privatizations.

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Hitler saw socialism as part of a Jewish conspiracy. Many of the socialist leaders in Germany, including Kurt Eisner, Rosa Luxemburg, Ernst Toller and Eugen Levine were Jews. So also were many of the leaders of the October Revolution in Russia. This included Leon Trotsky, Gregory Zinoviev, Lev Kamenev, Dimitri Bogrov, Karl Radek, Yakov Sverdlov, Maxim Litvinov, Adolf Joffe, and Moisei Uritsky. It had not escaped Hitler's notice that Karl Marx, the prophet of socialism, had also been a Jew.

It was no coincidence that Jews had joined socialist and communist parties in Europe. Jews had been persecuted for centuries and therefore were attracted to a movement that proclaimed that all men and women deserved to be treated as equals. This message was reinforced when on 10th July, 1918, the Bolshevik government in Russia passed a law that abolished all discrimination between Jews and non-Jews.

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In Mein Kamph Hitler offered some insight into his thinking on exercise of power and in particular the important role of propaganda, his contempt of parliamentary democracy and the Weimar Republic. Hitler also wrote of the need for a national revival and the quest for living space. Hitler linked his hatred of communism with his hatred of Jews. In Hitler’s mind Russia was the centre of a Jewish conspiracy, a concept reinforced in Hitler’s thinking by the fact that many of the leaders of the Bolshevik Revolution were Jewish.