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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 1:20:41 PM
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judii1
Posts: 355
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From: The Frozen Thumb of MI!
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I saw the school supplies lists for my grandchildren's schools. One of the teachers wanted the one of the kids to have 4 boxes of crayons, 12 pencils, etc. Dd said that she was going to supply the basics of what they needed but she wasn't going to supply stuff for the whole school. (She has 4 kids going to school.)She sent a note to the teacher telling her to let her know when the child needed more as she has extra items on hand in a closet at home.
I know that my gs used a camera last year (first grade) They wrote a book about their community and everyone had their own camera to take pictures of the park, fire department, etc.
I really don't understand why the parents need to send in cleaning supplies for the class or extra supplies for other children. I am not trying to be selfish. Here is the point I am trying to make. Usually a school district will get about $10,000 for each child per year. If the school year lasts 180 days, the school is getting about $55.55 per day per child. Why can't the school supply the materials if the parents can't afford them?
< Message edited by judii1 -- 9/6/2008 1:27:23 PM >
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 2:29:45 PM
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hoppersfan
Posts: 844
Joined: 6/27/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: judii1
I saw the school supplies lists for my grandchildren's schools. One of the teachers wanted the one of the kids to have 4 boxes of crayons, 12 pencils, etc. Dd said that she was going to supply the basics of what they needed but she wasn't going to supply stuff for the whole school. (She has 4 kids going to school.)She sent a note to the teacher telling her to let her know when the child needed more as she has extra items on hand in a closet at home.
I don't know what grade you're talking about, but I can definitely see needing 4 boxes of crayons and AT LEAST 12 pencils to last the school year. I seriously doubt that your daughter would have been supplying stuff for the whole school by sending that. We're talking about spending a couple of bucks on those things. Perhaps the reason the teacher asked for those supplies up front is because she has found that parents are much less likely to send additional supplies later in the school year. I certainly have seen that.
I just don't see why someone would make a big deal out of 4 boxes of crayons and 12 pencils. It amazes me.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 3:47:40 PM
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artemis
Posts: 939
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quote:
ORIGINAL: judii1
Usually a school district will get about $10,000 for each child per year. If the school year lasts 180 days, the school is getting about $55.55 per day per child. Why can't the school supply the materials if the parents can't afford them?
It's not like they divide that amount out and give it to each kid equally. I guarantee that a low-income, special ed, at-risk child will get a much higher percentage spent on him/her than an "average" kid. And just like a business, there are costs that have to be covered like electricity, water, salaries, furniture, computers, etc. Besides, most schools do supply materials to students who really can't afford them, they just don't supply materials to the whole school. I don't think any teacher would advocate a parent choosing between kleenexes for the classroom and dinner that night. If you don't think supplies are necessary, or can't afford them, call/e-mail the teacher and let her know so she can plan accordingly or adjust for your child.
The supplies I ask for at the begining of the year are enough to get us started or maybe make it through the first semester. After that, I buy kleenexes, crayons, etc. myself. I know that many, many teachers spend hundreds of dollars a year on their classrooms. It gets worse every year as budget cuts and earmarked funding leaves less and less for the classrooms. Oh, and a push for more "hands-on" and interactive lesson plans. Disposable cameras are a lot more expensive than a xeroxed worksheet 
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 4:08:39 PM
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Kath
Posts: 17140
Joined: 2/28/2005
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quote:
I just don't see why someone would make a big deal out of 4 boxes of crayons and 12 pencils. It amazes me.
My kids never even used one box, let alone 4. There is no way I would send 4 boxes of crayons.
quote:
I seriously doubt that your daughter would have been supplying stuff for the whole school by sending that.
and I don't doubt that they request 4 boxes of crayons to make up for the parents that don't send anything.
quote:
Usually a school district will get about $10,000 for each child per year.
This is off topic but our district spends 7500 per student.
When I get everything on the list I spend close to 50 bucks a kid. I am so glad my kids are no longer in elementary school. (I know it will be thought that I am exaggerating but, I'm not)
quote:
We're talking about spending a couple of bucks on those things.
That seems like a pretty cavalier attitude about someone else's money. They have a right to know where those supplies are going.
and if there are left over supplies, who gets them?
< Message edited by Kath -- 9/6/2008 4:43:55 PM >
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 4:26:34 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10432
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Cow country, Upstate NY
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I bought what is on my third grader's modest list, but I didn't send it all yet. I bought extra of things I think he might need extras of, like paper, crayons, erasers, and pencils. I told him to let the teacher know I would keep the extras at home and told Noah to let me know when he needed more of something.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 5:03:19 PM
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hoppersfan
Posts: 844
Joined: 6/27/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Kath
quote:
I just don't see why someone would make a big deal out of 4 boxes of crayons and 12 pencils. It amazes me.
My kids never even used one box, let alone 4. There is no way I would send 4 boxes of crayons.
Children drop crayons, break them, bite them, all kinds of things go on (at least in kindergarten), so I can definitely see why the teacher asked for 4 boxes.
quote:
I seriously doubt that your daughter would have been supplying stuff for the whole school by sending that.
and I don't doubt that they request 4 boxes of crayons to make up for the parents that don't send anything.
Personally, the supplies that I request go straight into each student's cubby. So, the supplies are used ONLY by the student that brought those supplies in. There are many parents who are extremely kind and generous, and they realize that not every parent is going to bring in the necessary supplies. If those parents send in extras and tell me that those supplies are SPECIFICALLY for children who do not have their own supplies, then, yes, I let those children have them. But, only then.
quote:
Usually a school district will get about $10,000 for each child per year.
This is off topic but our district spends 7500 per student.
When I get everything on the list I spend close to 50 bucks a kid. I am so glad my kids are no longer in elementary school. (I know it will be thought that I am exaggerating but, I'm not)
quote:
We're talking about spending a couple of bucks on those things.
That seems like a pretty cavalier attitude about someone else's money. They have a right to know where those supplies are going.
and if there are left over supplies, who gets them?
Well, in my case, they go back to the child that brought them in. I can tell you that crayons, glue, and table cleaner are not left over at the end of the year. I end up buying more of those things myself starting around Christmas, and throughout the remainder of the year.
I'm sorry that you feel my attitude is cavalier if I find it absurd for parents to fuss about a couple of dollars' worth of supplies that their children will no doubt use during the school year. I would find it cavalier of someone to expect other people to furnish their child's supplies. And, it happens every day.
I don't know how to do quote boxes or whatever they are called, but I did reply to the above statements in bold print.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 5:28:51 PM
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Kath
Posts: 17140
Joined: 2/28/2005
Status: online
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quote:
I would find it cavalier of someone to expect other people to furnish their child's supplies. And, it happens every day.
I agree with you. But some parents just can't afford it. and with some and their financial circumstances I wouldn't suggest they are spending their money foolishly on movies or something. I'm sure some are like that but not all.
quote:
I don't know how to do quote boxes or whatever they are called, but I did reply to the above statements in bold print.
I saw it. :)
(to quote, copy and paste what you'd like to respond to, keep it highlighted and use the quote button above.)
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 6:07:45 PM
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Kath
Posts: 17140
Joined: 2/28/2005
Status: online
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quote:
Personally, the supplies that I request go straight into each student's cubby.
Here they just all go in a cupboard.
I can imagine is it frustrating for a teacher to have to shell out money for supplies. I know Amy has said something about it with her classes. Why doesn't the PTA help out with this kind of thing? Have other options been explored, like having a class bake sale to pay for supplies?
Like I said, for us elementary was really expensive. High school is much cheaper.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 6:14:35 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10432
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Cow country, Upstate NY
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Do you guys label their supplies? We sharpied everything but the pencils and Noah only has 8 kids in his class. I don't understand how things could be "shared" with other kids if they are labeled. Kids of elementary age would be fighting hot from the injustice of that, or at least all the ones I know would be.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 6:22:09 PM
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Kath
Posts: 17140
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They didn't want them labeled. Same with kleenix. I used to buy puffs plus because I thought Dan would get them and even put his name on them, but found that they go in the supply cupboard adn a box would stay on the teacher's desk. So I just bought kleenix, I still couldn't buy generic.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 6:28:40 PM
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PrincessDonna
Posts: 10432
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Cow country, Upstate NY
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Our list had Kleenex, plastic forks and spoons, paper plates, and construction paper listed as classroom supplies. Those I didn't label, but everything else I did.
I think even if I were told not to label things...I would anyway. 
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 6:43:36 PM
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macokjc
Posts: 266
Joined: 2/24/2008
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quote:
Usually a school district will get about $10,000 for each child per year. If the school year lasts 180 days, the school is getting about $55.55 per day per child. Why can't the school supply the materials if the parents can't afford them?
I think the cost of public education has gotten way out of hand, and the original system served it's purpose but is not longer working. That's a discussion for another day, perhaps.
I, however, in addition to sending my kids to a private school and buying their supplies, pay over $4800 a year in school taxes alone. I am NOT interested in paying more because children can't bring in the supplies. Parents need to start taking more responsibility for their child's education - and it blows my mind that some just can't be bothered to buy their child a box of crayons. However, there is no real way to penalize the parents without making the children suffer - and what good would that do?
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 7:20:53 PM
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Kath
Posts: 17140
Joined: 2/28/2005
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quote:
However, there is no real way to penalize the parents without making the children suffer - and what good would that do?
That is the problem.
One teacher would buy those spiral notebooks for a dime in August and the kids would have to pay to have one. I don't see anything wrong with that at all.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 9:21:00 PM
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zoebob
Posts: 8785
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Kath
quote:
However, there is no real way to penalize the parents without making the children suffer - and what good would that do?
That is the problem.
One teacher would buy those spiral notebooks for a dime in August and the kids would have to pay to have one. I don't see anything wrong with that at all.
That's a good idea. My mom teaches math and requires students to use pencils. One year I got her a mug that said "Pencils 5 cents" on it and she would keep new pencils in it. If a kid forgot a pencil he could put a nickel in the cup and get one. She would buy them at Sam's club for a little less than that and it was easy for most kids to come up with a nickel if they needed a pencil.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 10:09:15 PM
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danas_mom
Posts: 554
Joined: 6/17/2005
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Here's my kids' lists this year.
Nathan, 2nd grade
Backpack (his old one is too small, they're both getting new ones this year but they will have these for 2 - 3 years at least)
2) 3rd grade writing tablets
2) 8 oz bottles glue
1) 24 ct Crayola crayons
1) pointed scissors
1) pkg gallon ziplocs
2) yellow highlighters
2) black sharpies
1) box washable markers
1) box dry erase markers
1) large spiral notebook
1) medium spiral notebook
3) white t-shirts w/ name on tags (they make theme shirts during the year)
4) 10 ct pkg pencils
2) pkg construction paper
1) pkg pencil tip erasers
2) rolls paper towels
3) folders w/ brads and pockets - red, blue, yellow
1) box kleenex
2) tubs wipes
1) tub playdough
Dana, 4th grade
Backpack
6) wide rule loose leaf paper
7) pkgs pencils
1) 24 ct Crayola crayons
4) glue sticks
1) pkg construction paper
3) boxes kleenex
5) pkg red pens
2) composition notebooks
1) art supply box
1) waterless hand sanitizer
6) folders w/ pockets and brads - green, yellow, orange
1) zippered binder
4) dividers w/ pockets for binder
1) pointed scissors
1) tub wipes
1) ruler
2) 2" erasers
1) pkg dry erase markers
1) pkg napkins
It's a lot of stuff, but I pick up a copy of the next year's lists when I'm getting supplies for the current year, so if I catch good clearance sales I'll know about how many to get. The lists don't change much from year to year. And I'm able to start shopping the mid-summer school supply sales that way too, before the lists are out. I got a lot of stuff at Walgreens this year for pennies on the dollar, I'd just have to watch the weekly ads and match up what they needed with what was on sale that week and mark it off as we got it. I still have a few extra pkgs of notebook paper, pencils, and some other things in there that I expect to have to replenish during the year. Oh and I still have a raincheck from Walgreens for .09 boxes of pencils, they've been out of stock for weeks. Heh.
< Message edited by danas_mom -- 9/6/2008 10:17:57 PM >
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/6/2008 10:12:25 PM
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artemis
Posts: 939
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Kath
quote:
However, there is no real way to penalize the parents without making the children suffer - and what good would that do?
That is the problem.
One teacher would buy those spiral notebooks for a dime in August and the kids would have to pay to have one. I don't see anything wrong with that at all.
I'm not sure it's legal for teachers to sell things to students. It might be a state-by-state thing or a school district thing, but I know that I am not allowed to sell anything to students without filling out paperwork and filing it with my principal. It would hardly be worth it for a 10 cent spiral. Sometimes good ideas aren't allowed in government-run environments
quote:
ORIGINAL: Kath
I can imagine is it frustrating for a teacher to have to shell out money for supplies. I know Amy has said something about it with her classes. Why doesn't the PTA help out with this kind of thing? Have other options been explored, like having a class bake sale to pay for supplies?
Yep. I teach jr. high, so it's not hyper-expensive, but I usually spend about $50 at the start of the year setting up my classroom and buying general supplies. This year I'm traveling between schools, so I have two classrooms. I spent about $75 to get the year started. I'll spend another $10-25/month on things that we could probably live without but will make my students' learning better and will make my life easier 
But like I've said all along, I don't think any teacher would fault a parent for not providing supplies if it is a money issue, as long as the teacher knows. But when only 40 of my students have a folder for my class, I don't know if the other 120 couldn't afford one, couldn't get to the store or just didn't feel like providing one. I had one parent contact me this year and explain that she hadn't gotten paid yet, so her son wouldn't have his supplies for another week. I am totally OK with him waiting to get his folder, and I wouldn't expect him to show up with anything more than the bare necessities.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/7/2008 10:52:35 PM
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dradynsmom
Posts: 120
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I'm one of those people who don't mind sending in basics - the stuff that was required when I was in school. Pencils, Glue Crayons and 1 box of tissues oh and paper and folders. However seeing my little brothers list this year for 4th grade i almost fainted. He is required to send in 35 dry erase marker, 5 tubs of baby wipes, 10 packages of office copy paper, and 5 boxe of Puffs Plus brand tissues (no other brands please), One supersize hand sanitizer (you now the economy ones with the pump that cost about 15 bucks) a 12 pack of sharpi markers, and he is required to bring in 10 boxes of 24 ct crayons. Beside the crayons it even says to be shared with others who don't have any. He also has to supply a 64 ct. crayon box This is on top of the rediculous amount of paper that he has to bring and something like 15 folders. My mom is not allowed to label anything. She did last year and they sent the stuff back saying it had to be unlabled - even his notebooks! So if his name isn't allowed on them who is truely using them? My mom recieves nothing back at the end of the year even though she know for a fact that there where 7 notebooks left over. She counted them through out the year. When she asked the teacher said that she does a "sharing policy" so that it instills good values in the children.
I am not saying that teachers should have to pay for stuff but I don't think that the parents should be supplying half the stuff on that list. What ever happen to the school supplying the teachers needs. And every parent paying for there own child? I'm not against sending in an extra box of crayons and some extra notebooks if poosible because Johnny's daddy got laid of work and they cain't afford it right now but having that much excess just seems like it would sit in the supply closets and just build and build and get shared with several several other classes.
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/8/2008 7:13:22 AM
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garsyt
Posts: 2239
Joined: 4/12/2005
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WOW! Draydyns! WOW!
So a teacher of, say, 25 kids gets 875 dry erase markers? Even if HALF the class is able to do this it's around 420 markers! I can't fathom a teacher needing even HALF of that for one school year. Last year my dd's 4th grade list and my ds's from this year also 4th grade only required 4 per child. Last year my dd's teacher had 108 to get him through year and my ds's teacher has 72, but they've cut class size dramatically in 4th grade this year in our school - which is a VERY GOOD thing! And the paper! Wow! I'm almost speechless!
I don't know about your mom or the other parents in that district but I'd be having one major hissy - especially coming from the district I'm in now where in the last 7 years we've built two new elementaries, a new middle school (state of the art and gorgeous!) and remodeled the old middle school into a ninth grade academy! That is just overkill - I'd like to know EXACTLY what my taxes were paying for. If every grade was like that - imagine that list times 4
quote:
she does a "sharing policy" so that it instills good values in the children. No all this does is allow some lazy parent who KNOWS how to milk the system an opportunity to show their children how to milk the system and never have to take responsibility for themselves. I mean I can understand sharing but there is a point to where a person has to say enough is enough. It's the folks like your mother Draydyns who are being taken advantage of. And that is WRONG!
Blessings,
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RE: School supplies - What really is necessary? - 9/8/2008 10:52:03 PM
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uponeagleswings
Posts: 1711
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Out here in the desert
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quote:
ORIGINAL: dradynsmom
He is required to send in 35 dry erase marker, 5 tubs of baby wipes, 10 packages of office copy paper, and 5 boxes of Puffs Plus brand tissues (no other brands please), One supersize hand sanitizer (you now the economy ones with the pump that cost about 15 bucks) a 12 pack of sharpi markers, and he is required to bring in 10 boxes of 24 ct crayons.
The only possible reason I can see for a list THAT extreme is that the teacher knows that for whatever reason only a few kids will have parents who feel obligated to get the entire list, and the list is designed so that the one child who brings everything makes up for all of his classmates who don't put in their share.
I can see a package of dry erase markers per child (with the potential to need replacing 1/2 way through the year)- in my class we had a class set of individual-sized whiteboards that we used for practicing spelling words and such. In order for us to be able to use them each child had to have a marker.
Requesting copy paper is related to the copy limits that artemis(Amy) mentioned. At one point my school considered requiring us to buy our own copy paper.
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