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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/9/2008 6:48:37 PM
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Roberta_
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From: East Bay Area
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I read the article and responded to the thread in the article.
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/9/2008 7:38:08 PM
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spitzu
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Kristin, now that's an interesting thought. Making people work for it. Hmm. Of course it would make more sense to me for it to be something worthwhile and not silly or demoralizing. But some kind of service, that is a good idea, IMO.
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/9/2008 8:12:51 PM
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Sideways
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We visited a few national parks on our honeymoon (I am not a beach person), and many of the trails we walked were originally laid out and kept up by the work programs set up by Roosevelt. It was cool.
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/9/2008 9:26:50 PM
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phosadaud
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Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
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With this agency, unless you are someone who wouldn't be "employable", their programs are specifically designed to get you hired somewhere. They help you with interviewing clothes, interview skills, job skills, etc. For instance, if you want to work in clerical, you can take classes on various computer programs, etc. All for free as long as you fulfill your obligations with the program (you have to work x number of hours, etc). When you work outside the agency, you have a case worker who works with your outside "employer" to find out what is and isn't working so they can help you improve your work skills. I'm assuming it would be different for those who would not be able to work in a regular job. It's a great program and really benefits our community. One of their industries is a paper shredding business. It's one our church and most businesses in our area use.
There was one middle-aged man at my parents church who worked for this agency. He is fairly mentally retarded (I apologize if that's not the "correct" term - I'm not sure what it is nowadays) and probably wouldn't be able to get a "normal" job (he is unable to care for himself). He works for the industry though. My dad said it's so fun talking with him because he LOVES his job and the fact that he is working and being productive. It truly is amazing the difference it made in his life and his sense of worth.
Like I said, it's a great program. But folks still fail at it. 
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Resume Quotations: "Reason for leaving last job: The owner gave new meaning to the word 'paranoia.' I prefer to elaborate privately."
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/9/2008 11:45:42 PM
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PatricksPeaches
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Joined: 5/13/2008
From: Michigan
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sideways
Certainly I believe in conditions for welfare, though. Any adult receiving must prove that they are looking for work, educating themselves for a better job or completely unable to do any kind of work. I also believe in a time limit for receiving welfare, even for those who've met the above conditions.
Just for an FYI
Here in Michigan we do have a program for such a thing. It is called Work First. This program requires those receiving CASH benefits to participate. They are required to be actively searching for jobs. The program provides a building with phones and newspapers to use. They help you with a resume and clothing for interviews. You are required to participate for a certain number of hours each week. They will also help with transportation if you need a vehicle. You are not allowed to turn down any job offer and must take one if it is offered. They will also help pay for schooling if you choose that route. But that also requires you work a certain number of hours.
Again, it is only for those getting CASH assistance. It doesn't apply for those receiving Food Stamps and/or Medicaid. Food Stamps is given out based on your income, expenses, and family size. So, if you have a job, your Food Stamps will be less. I believe Medicaid also goes by your income.
Just thought I'd share. I am not sure if there are programs like this elsewhere in the US. Just my experience here in Michigan.
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/10/2008 12:00:46 AM
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Memaw.
Posts: 2453
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From: Sunflower State
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quote:
I am not sure if there are programs like this elsewhere in the US. Just my experience here in Michigan.
In Kansas it is called KanWork.
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/10/2008 7:42:34 AM
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macokjc
Posts: 256
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quote:
I like what they did when I lived in PA and had to get aid. You could get the grant based on how many were in your household. If you had one more child, they didn't do anything. If you got pregnant a second time while on aid, they would reduce your monthly grant.
I live in PA, and that's not what they do where I live. I think certain parts do change by county. Here it is sliding scale based on income and number of people in the household.
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/10/2008 3:28:32 PM
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phosadaud
Posts: 10538
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From: Washington State
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I should clarify that the program I shared about is not a government program and is only local - not state wide.
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~Kristin~
Resume Quotations: "Reason for leaving last job: The owner gave new meaning to the word 'paranoia.' I prefer to elaborate privately."
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/13/2008 3:59:42 AM
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OneOfHisJewels
Posts: 2550
Joined: 8/9/2007
From: California
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quote:
ORIGINAL: 3cappuccinosmom
quote:
Well, not to pick nits, but they were getting TV specials by their 14th child, and community help and exposure long before that. Nowadays they do an awful lot of specials and TV appearances, but I completely agree that they are not having more children for that reason, but they sure do make the most hay out of every birth.
If you say so.  What I'm trying to say though, it isn't fair to say "Well, it's easy for *them* to have a bunch of kids, getting all those freebies". Because the conviction came long before the media exposure, and they stuck with it.
Well, if you read their website, the kids' piano teacher was doing all their laundry for them for free since about 8 kids....up until the older girls got old enough to take over the job....
and they've been helped in all sorts of ways before TLC.
I'm not saying that they necessarily have it easy....but they do seem to feel entitled to help...they just don't get it from the government..
and, true, they did live in a small rental up to about 15 kids...but if they hadn't gotten the bigger house(which TLC did provide much of the materials and labor for), they MAY have decided they were crowded enough at 16 and not gone on to the next two...we just don't know...
I wasn't trying to be judgemental of them in any way, but once they became famous, circumstances DID become different for them than the average family trying to have a bunch of kids and make a living.
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/13/2008 10:56:17 AM
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peculiar_lady2
Posts: 9789
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quote:
Well, if you read their website, the kids' piano teacher was doing all their laundry for them for free since about 8 kids....up until the older girls got old enough to take over the job....
I only have five kids....so I can imagine the laundry that would pile up with three more active little ones....and I can imagine that one washer and dryer just wouldn't handle it (and as you said, they rented a house so I can bet that it didn't have space or hookups for more then one washer and dryer). I now do laundry every day...at least two or three loads...otherwise it gets behind very fast. Just the other day (thursday) the heating element went out in our dryer, and I am now trying to figure out how to take care of about ten loads of laundry that HAVE to be done. I will probably end up at the laundry mat if hubby can't get the heating element fixed. So I can definitely imagine how hard it would be to have little babies and have to deal with laundry that far exceeds what your own machines can handle. There is nothing wrong with her having accepted the help offered from the piano teacher.
However, you just confirmed what Maggie said, that they didn't always get handouts and freebies. Like you said, the piano teacher helped with laundry when they got to 8 kids....before that she didn't.
quote:
I'm not saying that they necessarily have it easy....but they do seem to feel entitled to help...they just don't get it from the government..
I do not get the feeling that they think/feel they are entitled to anything...government provided or privately provided. I do however feel that they know how to humbly accept help. That can sometimes be a harder lesson to learn that any other lessons in life...and once learned it tends to carry over for the rest of your life. People that have the personality of not wanting to rely on others will at some point have to...thus is life and interactions with others. It is very humbling to accept things...even as simple as accepting church provided meals after a baby is born. (not saying you have not been there, but...) Unless you have been in those kinds of situations you really can't understand how humbling it is to go through...and those onlookers who don't understand could say it is an entitlement attitude, when in actuality it is just simply accepting of the reality of what they can and can not personally handle at the moment. That however is not to say that it shows that the family is already too big...there will always be times, even with only one child, when it is just too hard to handle that day...that alone doesn't mean you need to decide for sure to never have kids again.
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/13/2008 10:59:38 AM
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phosadaud
Posts: 10538
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Washington State
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I guess I don't see how what they are doing for TLC isn't considered "working" and the support they get as a result of that work isn't considered "compensation". It may not be a traditional "job", but it's still work IMHO.
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~Kristin~
Resume Quotations: "Reason for leaving last job: The owner gave new meaning to the word 'paranoia.' I prefer to elaborate privately."
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RE: When is a family too big. - 9/13/2008 12:36:49 PM
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OneOfHisJewels
Posts: 2550
Joined: 8/9/2007
From: California
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quote:
However, you just confirmed what Maggie said, that they didn't always get handouts and freebies. Like you said, the piano teacher helped with laundry when they got to 8 kids....before that she didn't.
I didn't exactly confirm what Maggie said(if you read the her first post on the subject before Sideways' response)...her implication was that they had NO help at all until 16 kids, and I was merely pointing out that yes, they have DID have help since before 16 kids...since about 8, and I think it is only fair to give credit where credit is due to the people that did help them. To say they had no help before 16 isn't fair to the people that did help them..it discredits them, and their help is just as valuable in its own way as what TLC did.
However, I think you had a very well thought out post and ALL your points were very good.....
After all, I spent a year doing laundry for a family of only 3 kids once a week because their mom was ill...as well as cooking lunch and dinner for their family once a week, ironing for them, cleaning their kitchen, and doing arts and crafts with their kids (every Tuesday)...and yes she had a hard time accepting help from our church at first, but she got over that... I had to stop though, cause it was beginning to affect MY health---doing that plus my normal job.
P.S. I do laundry every day too, except Sundays (day of rest)..and Tuesday (the day my mom washes her own and my dad's clothes)...when you're taking care of someone who gets food all over everything, in spite of hairdresser capes and towels being used...the laundry piles up
P.S. 2 Sorry to hear about your dryer..I know it's a pain when appliances break down.
< Message edited by OneOfHisJewels -- 9/13/2008 1:26:35 PM >
_____________________________
"We basically use what I have seen referred to as "get off your butt" parenting. It employs more interaction, more redirection, more prevention, and usually less spanking."
-Mrs. Wifey
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