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[Poll]
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Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong
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| TRUE - Christians have no business ever drinking alcohol |
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| FALSE - Cristians having an occasional glass of wine is not sinful |
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Total Votes : 120
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(last vote on : 10/5/2008 1:40:56 AM)
(Poll will run till: -- )
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/16/2008 8:45:38 AM
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agapetos
Posts: 5558
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From: This side of the lil duck pond!
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quote:
I actually worry about when we are with the Messiah, and He hands me wine. I am likely to say, "Do I hafta? Can I just have grape juice? Please?" I suspect that He's got that issue covered and whatever we're given to drink we will love.
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/16/2008 9:50:32 AM
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Hayseed
Posts: 521
Joined: 4/15/2006
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Most Americans have never been taught or even had the concept brought to their attention about drinking in moderation and with responsibility.
I homebrew. My kids see daddy drink a beer or two in a sitting without getting drunk. They are exposed to the concept. In fact, they've never seen a drunk person. So they don't equate beer with drunkeness. When they're old enough to make the choice they'll know that you can enjoy beer and be able to not have to drink it in 6, 12 or 24 bottle sittings.
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My entire goal in life is to live exactly like the man who was falsely accused of being a drunkard, heretic and a friend of sinners by the religious people. So, don't be surprised if I'm not too concerned if you think ill of me.
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/16/2008 12:16:04 PM
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Dred
Posts: 199
Joined: 10/11/2007
From: Alabama
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Hayseed
I homebrew.
How shocking! But I guess you are one who truly understands how silly these theories about 1st century grape juice are. There is so much work in homebrewing devoted to avoiding the presence of wild yeast. You boil the wort for an hour, then try desperately to cool it quickly while keeping it somewhat covered, perhaps using a sink full of ice or one of those coils of copper tubing. Then you try to seal it into a big bucket (or carboy) with a massive dose of good yeast in the hope that any wild yeast contamination won't have a chance due to all the competition. Then there's all the careful sterilization of bottling day, but you still worry about wild yeast spores because you can't keep it away from the air the whole time. If you're very careful, it probably turns out okay, but you still open up a bottle of foam now and then. Of course, leaving a sweet liquid to the mercy of wild yeast will make it even more alcoholic since they tend to metabolize even the more complex sugars which should be left intact to make it taste good.
Most alcohol phobic folks don't realize how ubiquitous yeast is. Fruits you find in the supermarket typically all contain some alcohol already, ranging from trace amounts to nearly 1%. Some varieties of overripe fruits have been found to contain around 5% alcohol, which is the same as your typical beer. All yeast creates alcohol as a waste product of their metabolism. This includes bread yeast. Though most of it comes out in baking, there is some still detectable in most any baked bread. Dogs, who have a very low alcohol tolerance, have even been known to get drunk from eating sour dough.
In ancient times, fermentation was usually accomplished without adding any particular yeast, but by using what was already present. In my college days, I once had a carton of orange juice turn into some nasty, high alcohol wine in the refrigerator. You just can't carry around sweet liquids without something happening. We only can today because they are pasteurized, sterilized and vacuum packed.
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"We count any belief in Him, even the smallest belief, better than any belief about Him." --from Robert Falconer, by George MacDonald
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/16/2008 6:35:53 PM
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bluestone
Posts: 2934
Joined: 2/25/2008
From: United States of America
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I was gonna drink some wine tonight, but I have a peach going bad on the counter.....
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/16/2008 7:24:20 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: a mother who let me live
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Now, squirrels.
Those sweet little things!
They're so cute and innocent, I'm sure they are among the called!
But you should see them cavorting in our back yard toward the end of plum season. What a sight!
We can't reach some of our plums, so we don't even try. Let the squirrels have them. We have a huge floor-to-ceiling window in the dining room, so we can just pull the chairs around so that they are facing out the window, sit down with some frosty glasses of iced tea, and watch the circus! the funniest part is when they try to walk the narrow fence-top.
It is hilarious! Very entertaining. I won't say the same thing for humans who get drunk.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/16/2008 7:31:14 PM
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zoebob
Posts: 8860
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
Status: online
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quote:
I have a neighbour who put down saucers of beer to trap slugs and snails and she went away for a few days. When she came back, her neighbour (who'd been feeding the cat) said she'd gone round one evening and heard a weird noise. It seems that a couple of hedgehogs had found the beer and drunk it... one was on it's back, waving it's feet in the air, the other was weeving amongst the marigolds...
LOL
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/16/2008 9:45:18 PM
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TrustingGod
Posts: 162
Joined: 6/19/2008
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As far as our kids going out and and drinking or not drinking - I don't think having or not having alcohol in the house is the deciding factor.
I believe it is ultimately the child's decision - and many factors go into - upbringing, example, peer pressure, curiosity...
I do believe that as parents, we need to TALK to our kids and let them know what our expectations are and WHY we have them. I tell my son that alcohol in and of itself is neither good or bad. I explain why we (his parents) have made the choices we have. We talk about what the Word says (or doesn't say) about it. We talk about the social issues, drunk driving, foolish decisions.
The point is, we talk. We don't just say, Don't do it. We don't even say, don't do it. We say, we'd rather you didn't and here's why. We ask, why would you want to? We have this same type of conversation about many things - drugs, sex, lying, stealing, music, choices.
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/16/2008 11:22:17 PM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3164
Joined: 4/16/2005
From: my mom by God
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My parents were casual drinkers. I don't think there was alcohol in our house at any given time. However, my first drink was...probably before I was ten. Drinking and getting drunk was what we did to have fun.
I, and my brothers and sister, all drank at one time or another usually to excess.
Its been a long time since I really drank like that. I did not, essentially, at least in the last ten years of my kids in school, drink at home. Neither of my kids consider drinking a good thing to do..at all....or drugs. It wasn't a factor in thier growing up.
Alcohol is like any other tool. Its not evil by itself. Its how you use it and why. My parents and most of their friends used alcohol to make themselves happy. ( Now that my dad is saved, they are viewing their old friends in a somewhat different light ) We, as their children, just took it one step further.
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You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 7:28:07 AM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3417
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From: a mother who let me live
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We had no alcohol at all in our home when I was a child, but there were certainly plenty of evidence of other addictions, some of it completely devastating, very damaging, to all those in our home. In order to escape these things, I learned how to become inebriated without the use of alcohol or other outside chemicals, because it was necessary to escape the insanity consistently demonstrated in our home.
_____________________________
Abiyah
"Ladies and gentlemen, there are things that you will only be able to learn by the weakest among us, and when you snuff them out, you are the one that loses." ~~Gianna Jesson, 1977 LA, CA, saline abortion survivor
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 11:38:33 AM
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Hayseed
Posts: 521
Joined: 4/15/2006
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Dred, you're obviously a person who's done a little homebrewing yourself.
Yes, it is very funny when I hear (I still hear it from time to time, but not as often as I used to) someone "teach" that the wine back then wasn't fermented. I have a hard time not laughing. Incedentally, I always figure that if someone can't understand certain things or will just ignore facts to teach what they want... why should I listen to them about anything? What else will they mix in there to get an agenda driving?
But, that may be tempting me "off-topic."
Trusting... that's exactly what needs to happen more: Actually, talking to your kids about stuff.
The scare tactics that adults employed on us when we were teens were such a joke. When we tried things and found out that they didn't just kill us on the spot we naturally wondered what else they were lying to us about.
I taught a youth group from the scripture that "sin if fun for a season" without over sensationalizing things. I told the kids that sure, "you'll get away with it for a while. You may or may not enjoy it for a while. But, there is a consequence to pay in the future and you don't know what your outcome will be."
It actually helped them receive truth and many of them had never even thought about it like that. They had just heard all the hyped up "death and destruction" messages that they naturally knew were bunk.
< Message edited by Hayseed -- 8/17/2008 11:47:20 AM >
_____________________________
My entire goal in life is to live exactly like the man who was falsely accused of being a drunkard, heretic and a friend of sinners by the religious people. So, don't be surprised if I'm not too concerned if you think ill of me.
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 12:15:26 PM
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MindySue69
Posts: 321
Joined: 8/5/2008
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It really is prudent to be TRUTHFUL.
Some people genuinely believe what they are taught. I remember being taught by a preacher with a doctorate in Hebrew and Greek all about how the wine was not fermented, and he used very impressive diagrams and lexicons and Greek words, explaining how the "good wine" that Jesus made was "good" because it was not fermented, it was fresh juice.
We all sit there and take it hook line and sinker because we are filtering everything though the lens of our current culture. Our current culture says that wine is bad.
Interesting how people who tout the KJV find no issue with the KJV calling it wine, when it "should" have been JUICE... ;)
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 12:20:13 PM
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1mlasp
Posts: 204
Joined: 12/9/2005
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quote:
All yeast creates alcohol as a waste product of their metabolism. This includes bread yeast. Though most of it comes out in baking, there is some still detectable in most any baked bread. Dogs, who have a very low alcohol tolerance, have even been known to get drunk from eating sour dough. Hmm....interesting...maybe when my friends come over I'll get them some grape juice and serve it with a six-pack of sourdough.
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 1:49:17 PM
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zoebob
Posts: 8860
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
Status: online
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You know, my SIL gave me a candle that was a fresh bread scent. It smelled like beer
_____________________________
L-R: DD1, Ellies DS2, DD2, Ellies DS1
L-R: Ellies DD1, Ellies DD2, DS, Ellies DS3
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 3:14:11 PM
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zoebob
Posts: 8860
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
Status: online
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ROFLOL. I don't have it anymore.
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L-R: DD1, Ellies DS2, DD2, Ellies DS1
L-R: Ellies DD1, Ellies DD2, DS, Ellies DS3
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 3:41:13 PM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 2188
Joined: 8/30/2007
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quote:
I forgot to stop and buy a bottle of wine tonight! Had a busy day and thought, wow, I can use a glass of blueberry wine tonight...that gave me a lot of ooomph to get through the rest of the day...and then I finished up and had to help someone else with her work....and I FORGOT.
This sounds like you are looking for the validation of man to justify drinking.
If your friend doesn't like it, it's her problem, not yours.
I'm sure if you question the Lord about it's rightness or it's wrongness, He will answer you.
Just because man says something is ok, doesn't make it ok. Same thing with something being wrong.
Take it to the Lord with the willingness to accept whatever answer Hr gives you.
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 4:19:11 PM
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oceangirl
Posts: 36
Joined: 8/13/2008
Status: offline
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lol Jesus turned water into wine didnt he
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 4:50:52 PM
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Liveloved
Posts: 2072
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We can put alcohol outside of our home but there can still be an ugly, bitter, vile spirit that lives within and that wreaks much greater havoc and defiles many. I'm not putting down those who have done this (put alcohol outside the home)---you probably are wellmeaning. But it is our heart that is the problem. Not the alcohol.
It's like gun control. I grew up in a home with loaded guns in the closets. But my father taught respect and proper care and use of firearms. The gun is not the evil.
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 6:26:40 PM
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MindySue69
Posts: 321
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
quote:
I forgot to stop and buy a bottle of wine tonight! Had a busy day and thought, wow, I can use a glass of blueberry wine tonight...that gave me a lot of ooomph to get through the rest of the day...and then I finished up and had to help someone else with her work....and I FORGOT.
This sounds like you are looking for the validation of man to justify drinking.
If your friend doesn't like it, it's her problem, not yours.
I wasn't looking for anything other than opinions. :)
I don't need psychological validation for anything.
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RE: Christians Drinking Wine (Moderately) is Wrong - 8/17/2008 7:38:24 PM
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MindySue69
Posts: 321
Joined: 8/5/2008
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LOL!!!
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