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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 10:18:43 AM
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Kath
Posts: 17125
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quote:
talk about the challenges of other people's expectations that all married women should have the desire to pop out a bunch of kids.
If this is the focus of your thread, then it will need to stay on topic. Fritz has said he only wants two general chat threads in the womens folders, which we have with the Kicka thread and the monthly chat thread.
We need to define the parameters a bit more. Is this for women who wish to totally remain childless or will it include women who have decided to limit their family to x amount of kids and get hassled for it?
Thanks!
Sincerely
Kath
Volunteer Assistant Administrator
Please do not send me PMs about this decision. Sharon is allowed to define the scope of the thread more, but if anyone wish to disagree with/discuss this action you will need to email Fritz at community@salemwebnetwork.com allowing time for a reply. Thanks!
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 11:03:33 AM
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sharonjef2007
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quote:
We need to define the parameters a bit more. Is this for women who wish to totally remain childless or will it include women who have decided to limit their family to x amount of kids and get hassled for it?
My initial intention was for this to be a place where women who were not TTC could come and support each other on that. A place where we could celebrate Aunt Flo and support each other on issues and problems regarding not wanting to have children or any more children.
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 11:04:46 AM
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Kath
Posts: 17125
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alrighty then. Thanks for clarifying Sharon.
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 11:11:34 AM
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sharonjef2007
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Now, with that in mind....here is my current situation...........
I know many women don't understand or really have a problem with my not wanting biological children. I fully understand that I'll never be able to please everyone, but I would like to be able to talk to my family about the decision when they mention it. But, when I do say, oh, I don't want to be pregnant, they jump all over me.
For example, let's take a look at my cousin Debby. She has PCOS and is having big time trouble getting pregnant. I listen to her and try to support her as much as I can in this. I don't understand her feelings, but I do know she is going through a hard time with it.
So, we were talking earlier this week about it all and she said to me, "Well, I guess even if you get married a year from now, you will be pregnant before me." I told her not to count on it and that I would rather adopt.
Was I insensitive to say that to her????? How can I talk about how I feel about it without hurting other people's feelings?
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my blog......Finally, a new last name!.......
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 11:20:54 AM
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KatMack
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From: Along the Canopy Roads
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Okay, now that we've clarified the "rules" for the thread, I'll join in. I'm a proud momma to three beautiful children that I love with all my heart. DH and I decided after little Kenna's birth that we were where God wanted us as a family, so I had a tubal. We feel led that if the Lord wants us to raise more children, we will foster or adopt. There are soooo many children out there that need good, positive parents in their lives!
quote:
Was I insensitive to say that to her????? How can I talk about how I feel about it without hurting other people's feelings?
That is soooo tough! Having never struggled with infertility, it's REALLY had to know what to say to others. I can imagine how much more difficult it will be now that I've made a choice to end my fertility.
I guess our best bet is to simply not discuss our choices regarding child-bearing and fertility unless we KNOW we can count on a sympathetic ear. The problem is, other people aren't always sympathetic! If only we as women could learn to respect each other's choices even when we don't agree with them.
--Kat
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<-- My sweet blessings.
"God will do what God will do. What I'm responsible for is to believe he's all he says he is and obey what he tells me to do. " -magdaleine
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 12:39:26 PM
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nHisize
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I don't know because I have the same prob with my friend. They have been trying to have kids for years. She talks about wanting kids sooo badly and is trying to get into foster care as well. I have told her that I didn't want kids, so I just didn't understand the hurt she was going through, but I would be there for her when she wanted to vent about it all.
I've never understood the ohh I want a family sooo bad n such. I've never had that extreme want. Maybe at some point I may want kids, but I'm not hurting and stressing over it. Prayers go out to all those that do, it's just not in me I guess.
I myself try not to discuss the topic with her, because I don't want to say the wrong thing.
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A New Beginning
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RE: The NOT TTC Thread..... - 8/22/2007 1:00:58 PM
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LaurainAL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: LaurainAL
quote:
Women who are married to Christian men, want to have lots of babies, breastfeed for a long time, stay at home with their children, homeschool, etc.
This is not true and exactly the kind of attitude that makes this atmosphere combative. I am married to a Christian man (he is even a pastor) and I have only 2 children, have a full time career, and will be putting my kids in school when that time comes. If I post anything regarding this kind of life I am sure to be flamed. I started a post several months asking if anyone had any experience with a tubal ligations. My first response was that it is wrong because you couldn't have anymore children. Well, DUH! That is the whole point.
I would like to see one thread in this huge forum where women who are different can come to chat without having to defend and giving links to their choices.
I just re-read my post from this morning. I want to apologize to Prudent. I know you were not being mean and I took out some frustrations about previous threads on you that had nothing to do with you. I am truly sorry.
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RE: The NOT TTC Thread..... - 8/22/2007 1:05:17 PM
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Hazel2
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Just want to weigh in on NOT wanting children. Before I started having them (at an alarming rate), I did not really want them. Not adopted not natural. It is a joy you discover and understand after having them. Billions of parents can't be wrong!
However ... I fully believe it is possible to have a Godly and full life without children from any source. Also, for me, pregnancy is terrifying. It is hard to explain the panic that sets in at about seven months when my belly is stretched to its outer limit and the baby is pummeling the underneath of my rib cage with all four limbs and I still have TWO MORE MONTHS TO GO and in those last two months, this little alien is supposed to DOUBLE in size. It is so out of my hands overwhelming. I don't begrudge any woman not wanting to go through the experience. Of course it is all worth it, but still ...
Another thing ... I don't think it is natural to want that groggy little newborn that is placed in your arms after the most harrowing physical experience of your life. It is human, and yet ... just barely?
So sisters who need this thread, God bless you and don't begrudge the rest of us who are experiencing these things. God makes the joy greater than the pain for a reason ... who in their right mind would submit to all of it if it weren't for the joy of it?
It's not You against Us ... at least in this case, the Us used to be You!
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Will you please remember my husband, John, in prayer He is not saved. Thank you and God bless you!
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 1:22:17 PM
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solo_soprano22
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From: I'm a Southern girl
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quote:
I've never understood the ohh I want a family sooo bad n such. I've never had that extreme want. Maybe at some point I may want kids, but I'm not hurting and stressing over it. Prayers go out to all those that do, it's just not in me I guess.
I told one of my friends recently that I'm not sure if I really want children after I marry (whenever that will be). I think, for me over the years, some people have acted like you get married...you have kids, and that's the way it's "supposed" to be for everyone. I just started thinking not everyone is meant to have kids (the way I see it, even Biblically).
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 1:34:02 PM
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LaurainAL
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I was married 5 years before we were ready to have children. We enjoyed those years by spending time with one another, finishing our educations, working on our careers. I wouldn't change a thing.
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 4:06:14 PM
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HisCovenant
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quote:
ORIGINAL: sharonjef2007
Was I insensitive to say that to her????? How can I talk about how I feel about it without hurting other people's feelings?
I think we have to use tact when speaking to others that we know are dying to have children while we are content, but God only knows where that line is. I also don't think we need to be held hostage by their feelings. They are hurting and we have a responsibility to minister to them- they really need our love and compassion. However, sometimes the most compassionate, loving thing we can do is speak the truth- even a painful truth. You just have to stay tuned into the Holy Spirit for when it is time to be gentle and when bold truth is His way.
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My friends call me Zippy!
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 4:30:16 PM
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HisCovenant
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We've been married for 13 years and I have no desire to have children. Of course, biological children would be accepted and loved, but I am not interested in adopting. I am content and until God either changes my attitude or circumstances, we will remain childless. Dh is fine with that. We always expected that at some point we would have a burning desire to have children as we have seen our friends go through, but it just never happened.
A couple of years ago my parents had to move in with us and I got the idea that God never gave me the desire so I could have my dad live with me. He is a manipulative, chaotic liar and I would not have allowed him into my home with children. I don't know if that's the reason why God has kept us from having children or not...
I don't really feel separated from the women's ministry at church. There are many activities that all women can be a part of that don't focus on children. The only time I ever feel "left out" is when there is an activity that is geared towards children- such as the women in my sunday school class getting together for a play date or the annual "children's choir concert" where all the parents come and act like they are not in a worship service with their cameras  . Otherwise, I have plenty of things in common with mothers, like hobbies, homemaking, feminine issues, wifely expectations, etc.
The only time I feel belittled is when I speak with those who subscribe to Quiver Full Theology, and having gone to only Southern Baptist and PCA churches that hasn't been much of a problem. Occasionally you find an odd women here and there who is QF, but it is not taught in the church. Most Christian women I have discussed this issue with simply can't understand because they desired children, yet they believe childless by choice is not sinful. I think most people assume that we are unable to have children and try not to bring it up to be sensitive to our feelings. In some ways, I appreciate their thoughtfulness, even though misplaced... but it irks me that there is an unnecessary barrier to our relationship because of others sensitivity.
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-HisCovenant/ Zipporah
My friends call me Zippy!
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 4:50:28 PM
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LaurainAL
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Hiscovenent: I have a relatively new friend who doesn't have any children. She is in her 1st marriage, but it is her husbands 2nd marriage and he has one child from the 1st. I don't know what her situation is, whether they are child free by choice, infertility, or any other reason. It's just never came up. But, if is does come up in conversation, would it be rude to ask her?
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 5:09:44 PM
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HisCovenant
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quote:
ORIGINAL: LaurainAL
Hiscovenent: I have a relatively new friend who doesn't have any children. She is in her 1st marriage, but it is her husbands 2nd marriage and he has one child from the 1st. I don't know what her situation is, whether they are child free by choice, infertility, or any other reason. It's just never came up. But, if is does come up in conversation, would it be rude to ask her?
I don't think it would be rude to ask her. If she doesn't want children she will not mind discussing it, if she has infertility problems, she may like to have support and understanding from you. However, you can preface your question with "If you don't want to discuss this, I fully understand..."
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-HisCovenant/ Zipporah
My friends call me Zippy!
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RE: The NOT TTC Thread..... - 8/22/2007 5:28:46 PM
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moon_mouse
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Hazel1
Just want to weigh in on NOT wanting children. Before I started having them (at an alarming rate), I did not really want them. Not adopted not natural. It is a joy you discover and understand after having them. Billions of parents can't be wrong!
It's not You against Us ... at least in this case, the Us used to be You!
See, this is exactly why we need this thread. I know you don't mean any harm by your statement, but it's something childfree people hear a lot, and it gets really old, not to mention that, when I'm in a less than generous mood, it sounds really condescending. I'm truly happy for you. I'm glad you are happy being a mommy. But, I'm not you. And, frankly, I welcome a place on CW to discuss the challenges of being CF in the Christian community without being told "ah, I was once like you." I repeat I know you don't mean to be condescending, it's just something that grates on your nerves after the 5,000th person has said it, KWIM?
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 5:34:05 PM
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moon_mouse
Posts: 378
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quote:
ORIGINAL: sharonjef2007
So, we were talking earlier this week about it all and she said to me, "Well, I guess even if you get married a year from now, you will be pregnant before me." I told her not to count on it and that I would rather adopt.
Was I insensitive to say that to her????? How can I talk about how I feel about it without hurting other people's feelings?
No, I don't think you were insensitive. You were talking about your desires for your life, not commenting on her choices or her circumstances. But, if you are concerned about it, you could always ask her about it. I'm sure even if she did take something you said the wrong way, making an effort to be sensitive and open a dialouge would help heal that up.
And, thanks for starting this thread. It's something I've thought about for a while myself!
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 5:43:13 PM
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moon_mouse
Posts: 378
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quote:
ORIGINAL: LaurainAL
Hiscovenent: I have a relatively new friend who doesn't have any children. She is in her 1st marriage, but it is her husbands 2nd marriage and he has one child from the 1st. I don't know what her situation is, whether they are child free by choice, infertility, or any other reason. It's just never came up. But, if is does come up in conversation, would it be rude to ask her?
For myself, I don't mind being asked if I have children, but I'm less comfortable with people asking if I plan on having them, just because the next question is usually "why." Procreation is one of the most personal things a couple can do, and I'm not sure how it became a topic people feel so free to ask about. In women's groups, I usually answer the "when" question with "we have no plans in that direction" because most women's groups work on the assumption that all women either have kids, have grown children, are trying to have kids, or are planning on having them at some point in the future. If a group knows that's not a part of my intentions, it gives them the opportunity to include me in other ways. But, I only discuss the "why" with people I'm very close to, and only if I know they respect me enough not to try to make me justify it. (It wouldn't do any good anyway. I don't debate or justify my decision to anyone.)
My advice would be to only discuss what she chooses to bring up directly. Let her take the lead on how much of that sort of intimate information she's comfortable with discussing.
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 5:44:40 PM
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TwinCityGirl
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quote:
ORIGINAL: LaurainAL
I don't know what her situation is, whether they are child free by choice, infertility, or any other reason. It's just never came up. But, if is does come up in conversation, would it be rude to ask her?
If she never brings it up it means she doesn't want to talk about it with you (or maybe anyone). If she wanted to talk to you about it, she would tell you.
I say don't ask. It puts her in a really bad spot if she has something she really wants to be kept private. She either has to tell you her private thing or she has to lie.
Ultimately, if she never brings it up, why does anyone else need to know? I mean, what does it change in anyone else's day-to-day life if they know Couple A can't have children, Couple B doesn't want children, Couple C had a child that died and can't do it again or Couple D has massive infertility problems and has spent tens of thousands of dollars trying to fix things but has had no luck.
What would that change in others' lives if they knew? They'd be more understanding or polite? Why not just assume that if they don't have kids and don't talk about it that you should politely understand that.
I mean no offense at all, and your question doesn't anger me. I'm just giving you my honest answer and I hope it doesn't come across rudely because it's not meant to be rude, just another opinion you can take or leave.
Thanks,
Jeanie
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RE: The NOT TTC Support Thread..... - 8/22/2007 6:55:39 PM
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LaurainAL
Posts: 1265
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I agree Jeanie. It doesn't matter why. That's why I have never brought it up and never will.
I like having a child free friend. I have interests outside my children and we talk about that. She is an accountant also, so we talk shop.
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Why do people feel the need to say things like that?!?!?