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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 3:15:00 PM
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bzirk
Posts: 2909
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From: Where the deer and antelope play
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I think the attitude you're seeing is one of frustration with a society that tends to white wash sin. When someone is really not told the truth about the devastation of sin, this cheapens in their minds the grace the Lord extends.Why does anyone need it if they really have nothing to repent of, or nothing major that is? In fact, this is the problem with so many churches soft pedaling the devastation of sin and instead appealing to the self-esteem of people. When this is done, there is nothing for grace to be contrasted with.
Thankfully, the Holy Spirit can overcome any inadequacies we have in presenting the truth. People know when they are drawn and convicted by the Holy Spirit and then refuse to heed it. That is why all people will be held to account for their response to the Lord on the day of judgement.
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may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so you will abound in hope by the power of the Holy Spirit. Romans 15:13
Great quote: I just ain't God and don't know it all. -- SonInMe1
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 3:25:07 PM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1999
Joined: 8/30/2007
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quote:
I think the attitude you're seeing is one of frustration with a society that tends to white wash sin. When someone is really not told the truth about the devastation of sin, this cheapens in their minds the grace the Lord extends.Why does anyone need it if they really have nothing to repent of, or nothing major that is? In fact, this is the problem with so many churches soft pedaling the devastation of sin and instead appealing to the self-esteem of people. When this is done, there is nothing for grace to be contrasted with.
I am certainly not on to white wash sin. In fact, I have been confronted about my harsh truthfulness. Through that whole interlude, I learned that condemnation is very different from truthfulness. The HS convicts, not man's words. ( Not saying at all that the HS doesn't use man, because He does)
And i know that the Lord used some pretty strong language, yet it was loving too. Even His strong usage didn't persuade the unrepentant. people still rejected Him.
I guess what I am saying is that when we "correct" another, they need to see the love that goes with it. That doesn't translate to ignoring the sin or even helping it along. They just aren't the same thing at all.
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 3:27:22 PM
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bzirk
Posts: 2909
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Where the deer and antelope play
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
quote:
I think the attitude you're seeing is one of frustration with a society that tends to white wash sin. When someone is really not told the truth about the devastation of sin, this cheapens in their minds the grace the Lord extends.Why does anyone need it if they really have nothing to repent of, or nothing major that is? In fact, this is the problem with so many churches soft pedaling the devastation of sin and instead appealing to the self-esteem of people. When this is done, there is nothing for grace to be contrasted with.
I am certainly not on to white wash sin. In fact, I have been confronted about my harsh truthfulness. Through that whole interlude, I learned that condemnation is very different from truthfulness. The HS convicts, not man's words. ( Not saying at all that the HS doesn't use man, because He does)
And i know that the Lord used some pretty strong language, yet it was loving too. Even His strong usage didn't persuade the unrepentant. people still rejected Him.
I guess what I am saying is that when we "correct" another, they need to see the love that goes with it. That doesn't translate to ignoring the sin or even helping it along. They just aren't the same thing at all.
I wasn't referring to you when I said that. Sorry it sounded that way.
_____________________________
may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so you will abound in hope by the power of the Holy Spirit. Romans 15:13
Great quote: I just ain't God and don't know it all. -- SonInMe1
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 7:02:21 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
Why would one be rebellious towards God, if one trusts that God is Sovereign and knows the actions beforehand that His children will commit?
How can a person who believes the murder of the unborn is ok with God trust in Him? Takes a double minded person to do such a thing.
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Do we not trust that God has a plan for us and for our actions? Do we not trust His word when it tells us that all things are done for His glory?(paraphrased) Do we not trust that God will do something miraculous with something we consider heinous?
I am not following how God's plan removes that fact that people who believe that abortion is ok with God are actually in rebellion against God...
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I tell you He can and does. No matter what awful choices we make, He can do something with them, IN SPITE OF US.
Frankly, not all of us, is us... His word made that clear, Judas being the flaming example...
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I personally do not believe in abortion. I do very strongly believe that it is a matter of choice. I do not/ would not and will not advocate an abortion for anyone. Should a person I come in contact with want to make that choice, yes I would discourage the notion. However, I would also pray for that person and extend the loving hand of God to them.
Of course... What makes you think I don't pray for those who are in rebellion against God? Because I don't given ground on the subject? Because I state truthfully what abortion is? Because I don't sugar coat it?
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"To whom much is given, much is required." The amount of forgiveness that has been extended to me, the amount of forgiveness by me is required.
I forgave the person that raped my kids, doesn't mean he's a nice guy and all is well.. He doesn't have a ounce of remorse for what he did... Ok we forgive those who support abortion... Guess what, they still support abortion... Now what? Act like everything is ok? Ignore what is going on? Ignore they are promoting sin and trying to gain support for their agenda?
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I do not question God's Sovereignty even with man's interference.
The collective rebellion of mankind doesn't amount to a grain of sand against God's sovereignty...
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Obviously, the person then hasn't repented. My point being that the focus is on the crime, using fear and intimidation to persuade an unrepentant crowd. It's the equivalent of bipping them upside the head with a Bible. Nothing you are saying is biblically incorrect.
You seem to ignore the fact that the people we are talking about believe the action isn't a sin...
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My problem is with the attitude exuded from you and others. I understand the passion with which you are pursuing this agenda, however, I'm not so sure you are conveying the love of Christ that I know you hold dear. I just think your passion may need to be tempered just a bit if you desire for the message to be heard.
The message is as plain as day in the word of God... You have people on this forum who are not wondering if abortion is right or wrong, but believing it's ok with God... Promoting the agenda, saying it's ok because one has a civic duty to vote and that voting isn't under God's jurisdiction... And other excuses... When people make an argument for murder in God's name they ask for His wrath, the type He reserves for His enemies. We are not talking about people who question and don't know, but assert murder of the unborn is not only acceptable but a right, and if you take that to the bottom line, a right granted by God...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 7:10:52 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
quote:
I think the attitude you're seeing is one of frustration with a society that tends to white wash sin. When someone is really not told the truth about the devastation of sin, this cheapens in their minds the grace the Lord extends.Why does anyone need it if they really have nothing to repent of, or nothing major that is? In fact, this is the problem with so many churches soft pedaling the devastation of sin and instead appealing to the self-esteem of people. When this is done, there is nothing for grace to be contrasted with.
I am certainly not on to white wash sin. In fact, I have been confronted about my harsh truthfulness. Through that whole interlude, I learned that condemnation is very different from truthfulness. The HS convicts, not man's words. ( Not saying at all that the HS doesn't use man, because He does)
And i know that the Lord used some pretty strong language, yet it was loving too. Even His strong usage didn't persuade the unrepentant. people still rejected Him.
I guess what I am saying is that when we "correct" another, they need to see the love that goes with it. That doesn't translate to ignoring the sin or even helping it along. They just aren't the same thing at all.
In this forum I see more "outrage" regarding the truthful talk of abortion than the act itself... I firmly believe some folks just can wrap their minds around the fact that people can be just that evil and have no more regards for the unborn than a wart they seek to remove...
This isn't about correcting anyone, but simply stating in an open forum that abortion is murder and those who support are in rebellion against God...
I know from years here that generally the desire for truthfulness in love equates to something far from the truth... It ends up being comprises, appeasement, and many times complete capitulation of the truth because how awful it is to judge another person.. How can you... Who are you... Where is the love... What about forgiveness... Agree to disagree... All the while 3500 children are murdered daily in cold blood...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: is it possible for Christians to be pro-abortion? - 9/20/2008 7:11:10 PM
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LoyalGypsy
Posts: 2457
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mikeman2
quote:
ORIGINAL: EdwardWagemann
I know some who are, in cases of rape or incest...but I can't agree with them.
Well lets break it down shall we? Christ-ian or Christ like. So if we call ourselves Christians and are trying to be Christ like we must ask ourselves, What would Jesus do? Can you see him driving someone to an abortion clinic under any circumstances? Could you imagine Joseph driving his wife to an abortion clinic with the justification that she was not a willing participant to have Christ?
Conversely, if we are only doing our own thing and doing what we think is only best for us then abortion can be defended as being our right to choose. It all boils down to serving the god of self or the God of us all.
Greetings,
quote:
What would Jesus do?
He could have aborted the gentiles ... or the whole human race for that matter, So I guess what Jesus did pretty much answers that question. At least for those who profess His name.
LG
< Message edited by LoyalGypsy -- 9/21/2008 10:13:06 AM >
_____________________________
Ex 19:5 Now therefore, if you will indeed obey My voice
...So the Persians ask that the 300 drop their arms. Leonidas responds; "Persians! Come and get them!"
300 The Movie
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 7:30:35 PM
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SpiritualPowers
Posts: 44
Joined: 9/9/2008
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Brothers and Sisters , My post was to say ,Calm your selves .I am prolife thats my view but our Father will judge every one for everything according to his word , we are having a discussion that is near and dear to alot of people . All in all were on the same team (TEAM JESUS IN FATHER GODS WORLD) and we conduct ourselves according to his word. I was judgemental in my second post here and a brother kindly reminded me We live, in and with LOVE, thats what were comanded to do. We should let the world know , Abortion is aginst the word of God but its there free will , but it should never be private or easy. Parents should know and consent and adoption is always a solution but murder is not. This is what you get when you teach American childern God cant be in goverment and if you call his name you will be suspended or arrested. An we Christians stay seated. God forgave us through the blood of Jesus Christ his son and we will forgive others there sins as he did ours . We need education and guidence and above all LOVE . Satan if taking millions of children becouse Americans do not know God or Jesus and that is what needs our passion .It is not our ability to judge but our ability to LOVE that makes us Children of a Living God. SovereigIsHe God Bless you my friend and thankyou for your message and LOVE, Your passion is Insprational. If it was all Gods will we would all be saved and in Heaven right now. God gave us free will so Love was our choice not our only option for him and others.
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 7:55:57 PM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1999
Joined: 8/30/2007
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quote:
How can a person who believes the murder of the unborn is ok with God trust in Him? Takes a double minded person to do such a thing.
How can a person who lies, think it's ok with God? Or how about the person who steals, slanders or gossips?
No sin is ok with God, period.
Your view is just very exclusionary.
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I am not following how God's plan removes that fact that people who believe that abortion is ok with God are actually in rebellion against God...
I'm not sure it is rebellion towards God. For some, such as myself, we see it as God knows the plans He has for each one of us and He also knows what He is going to do with and in our lives, even if we make bad choices. Beliefs can be changed, actions can not.
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Frankly, not all of us, is us... His word made that clear, Judas being the flaming example...
I don't know what you mean by this statement.
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Of course... What makes you think I don't pray for those who are in rebellion against God? Because I don't given ground on the subject? Because I state truthfully what abortion is? Because I don't sugar coat it?
I never meant to imply that you wouldn't or don't pray for those in rebellion. I was simply stating what it is that I do, that is all.
Like I said earlier, I understand putting the truth boldly out there. I know the flack received from it too. I'm not at all suggesting that you stop telling the truth. I am however suggesting that you temper it with love. The love is missing from your posts, John.
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I forgave the person that raped my kids, doesn't mean he's a nice guy and all is well.. He doesn't have a ounce of remorse for what he did... Ok we forgive those who support abortion... Guess what, they still support abortion... Now what? Act like everything is ok? Ignore what is going on? Ignore they are promoting sin and trying to gain support for their agenda?
Yes, they probably do still support abortion and will probably continue to do so in the future. What do you have to gain by being bitter? I mean at some point and time, you are going to have to come to the conclusion that you simply can not change everyone's mind. Your message is very clear, it really is, but I'm afraid that is is disregarded because of the way it is delivered. (I'm trying to be your friend here, not attack or hurt you).
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The collective rebellion of mankind doesn't amount to a grain of sand against God's sovereignty...
We are in complete agreement here. Do you not trust the when God says, "vengeance is mine", He means it. Is that not enough justice to satisfy you?
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You seem to ignore the fact that the people we are talking about believe the action isn't a sin...
Well, I wasn't ignoring it, I guess I had a different train of thought going... I honestly wasn't considering them not seeing abortion as a sin.
That's like saying that lying isn't a sin....
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The message is as plain as day in the word of God... You have people on this forum who are not wondering if abortion is right or wrong, but believing it's ok with God... Promoting the agenda, saying it's ok because one has a civic duty to vote and that voting isn't under God's jurisdiction... And other excuses... When people make an argument for murder in God's name they ask for His wrath, the type He reserves for His enemies. We are not talking about people who question and don't know, but assert murder of the unborn is not only acceptable but a right, and if you take that to the bottom line, a right granted by God...
I'm failing to see how belief relates to voting. Are you speaking of candidates here? I'm just not following your train of thought.
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 8:03:41 PM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1999
Joined: 8/30/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
In this forum I see more "outrage" regarding the truthful talk of abortion than the act itself...
Again it's not the truth that is offensive, or at least not to me, it's the deliverance of the message.
It is somewhat disconcerting that there is such outrage over abortion, yet the same outrage is not proclaimed about other sins. I just don't get that. All sin should be offensive to us as Christians, not just certain pet sins that really bother us.
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 8:53:30 PM
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bzirk
Posts: 2909
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Where the deer and antelope play
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
quote:
In this forum I see more "outrage" regarding the truthful talk of abortion than the act itself...
Again it's not the truth that is offensive, or at least not to me, it's the deliverance of the message.
It is somewhat disconcerting that there is such outrage over abortion, yet the same outrage is not proclaimed about other sins. I just don't get that. All sin should be offensive to us as Christians, not just certain pet sins that really bother us.
I hear you. Frankly, I think there ought to be a lot of outrage over all the casual attitudes about divorce that are found in the Church.
_____________________________
may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so you will abound in hope by the power of the Holy Spirit. Romans 15:13
Great quote: I just ain't God and don't know it all. -- SonInMe1
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 9:18:16 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
How can a person who lies, think it's ok with God? Or how about the person who steals, slanders or gossips?
No sin is ok with God, period.
Your view is just very exclusionary.
The subject is abortion... Your view seems to ignore that fact...
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I'm not sure it is rebellion towards God.
If it's not, what is?
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For some, such as myself, we see it as God knows the plans He has for each one of us and He also knows what He is going to do with and in our lives, even if we make bad choices. Beliefs can be changed, actions can not.
Yes, they can be changed, but that doesn't equate them being changed... The probably of something doesn't mean it's going to happen...
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I don't know what you mean by this statement.
Not everyone who claims Christ is of Christ...
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Like I said earlier, I understand putting the truth boldly out there. I know the flack received from it too. I'm not at all suggesting that you stop telling the truth. I am however suggesting that you temper it with love. The love is missing from your posts, John.
Whatever that means... By all means tell me what I should say? That one can believe murder is ok and claim Christ? Telling me that love is missing doesn't amount to anything when you offer nothing of an example...
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Yes, they probably do still support abortion and will probably continue to do so in the future. What do you have to gain by being bitter?
Bitter? Excuse me? Instead of falsely charging me why not deal with the subject matter? This is what I mean... Not dealing with the reality... People don't repent, the continue to support, but I am bitter? Amazing...
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I mean at some point and time, you are going to have to come to the conclusion that you simply can not change everyone's mind.
Other than to direct attention away from the subject I don't know why this is mentioned....
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Your message is very clear, it really is, but I'm afraid that is is disregarded because of the way it is delivered. (I'm trying to be your friend here, not attack or hurt you).
It's disregarded because it's the truth... I am afraid the call to sugar coat the truth is here...
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We are in complete agreement here. Do you not trust the when God says, "vengeance is mine", He means it. Is that not enough justice to satisfy you?
Excuse me? Where are you coming from? Where have I said vengeance is mine, and not God's? These comments seem to come out of nowhere...
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You seem to ignore the fact that the people we are talking about believe the action isn't a sin...
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Well, I wasn't ignoring it, I guess I had a different train of thought going... I honestly wasn't considering them not seeing abortion as a sin.
That's like saying that lying isn't a sin....
What? They say it's not wrong, it's not a sin, God is ok with it... Read their words, their excuses... What makes you think they believe it's a sin? Simply because it is?
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I'm failing to see how belief relates to voting.
Really... Not connection whatsoever? How a person votes has NOTHING to do with what they believe? 
quote:
Are you speaking of candidates here?
Speaking of those who support candidates...
Again... Something you are failing to deal with is people are with a clear mind promoting the idea that God is ok with abortion... The are not seeking an answer to a question, they are attempting to push an agenda of evil in the name of God...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 9:24:34 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
Again it's not the truth that is offensive, or at least not to me, it's the deliverance of the message.
How is that? You seem confused on the issue actually... You don't believe those who support abortion think it's ok... In fact you have spent more time setting up and tackling windmills than the subject matter...
quote:
It is somewhat disconcerting that there is such outrage over abortion, yet the same outrage is not proclaimed about other sins. I just don't get that. All sin should be offensive to us as Christians, not just certain pet sins that really bother us.
Ponder this... It would seem to this very simple guy that abortion should be a slam dunk in regards to what is right and wrong. Guess what? it's not... Even those who claim Christ argue over it's being right or wrong... If anything should be disconcerting that is one of them... And of course this thread is about abortion not sin in general, so yes it's going to be what is talked about, or does one have to mention every time that all sin should be offensive to us as Christians when one mentions that one sin is?
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 9:26:53 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
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Bottom line... Can a Christian be an unrepentant sinner? Make it any sin you wish... Homosexuality, pedophile, lying, stealing, murder, unbelief, whatever...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 9:53:12 PM
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deliveredarling
Posts: 1999
Joined: 8/30/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
Bottom line... Can a Christian be an unrepentant sinner? Make it any sin you wish... Homosexuality, pedophile, lying, stealing, murder, unbelief, whatever...
Obviously not, even though that is debated too. Not chasing windmills John. I was hoping to help you get your message across to a point that people would be willing to listen to it without feeling like they were being pistol whipped. If it makes you feel like you are doing something productive in furthering a cause, go ahead and be the bull in a china cabinet.
The fact is, that this behavior (the acceptance of abortion) should not come as some great big surprise to any of us. To be outraged is a waste of energy, especially when He told us in His Word that these things would occur.
You asked if it isn't rebellion towards God what is it? May I suggest that it is a misdirection, a concept not understood, maybe a person who says they know Jesus, but don't know that they don't know Him.
How do you think the outrage, the attacks affect them? Is it really an effective to to use for correction and reproof? Does sarcasm and facetiousness get the point across?
What if I was one of them and not familiar with your debate style? What message would you really be sending me? Do you think I would feel comfortable enough to pm you for further clarification?
I know your sincerity and I have watched for consistency in your responses. Not all here have noticed. Maybe, just maybe someone is reading this thread ans struggling with a decision or struggling with guilt . Wouldn't you rather them see love than condemnation?
I don't know why people could even question whether it is a sin or not. I suppose the technicalities of when life begins could affect the way they believe. I do know it is a choice, just as much as choosing Jesus Christ to be the Lord of their lives is. For either choice there is consequence, good or bad.
I'm done here John. Peace to you my friend.
_____________________________
"Now no one after lighting a lamp covers it over with a container, or puts it under a bed: but he puts it on a lampstand, in order that those who come in may see the light."
Luke 8:16
http://www.myspace.com/egaip
Come visit
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RE: RE: - 9/20/2008 10:07:27 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deliveredarling
Obviously not, even though that is debated too. Not chasing windmills John. I was hoping to help you get your message across to a point that people would be willing to listen to it without feeling like they were being pistol whipped. If it makes you feel like you are doing something productive in furthering a cause, go ahead and be the bull in a china cabinet.
Yes, telling the plain truth is a bull in china cabinet... It painfully obvious you can't wrap you mind around the issue...
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The fact is, that this behavior (the acceptance of abortion) should not come as some great big surprise to any of us.
No surprise here...
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To be outraged is a waste of energy, especially when He told us in His Word that these things would occur.
No outrage here...
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You asked if it isn't rebellion towards God what is it? May I suggest that it is a misdirection, a concept not understood, maybe a person who says they know Jesus, but don't know that they don't know Him.
It's the concept really that hard? Abortion is murder... Murder is a sin... Bible 101 right?
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How do you think the outrage, the attacks affect them?
What outrage? What attacks?
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Is it really an effective to to use for correction and reproof? Does sarcasm and facetiousness get the point across?
More windmills...
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What if I was one of them and not familiar with your debate style? What message would you really be sending me? Do you think I would feel comfortable enough to pm you for further clarification?
The people I am speaking of don't seek clarification, they seek the destruction of unborn children in the name of God...
quote:
I know your sincerity and I have watched for consistency in your responses. Not all here have noticed. Maybe, just maybe someone is reading this thread ans struggling with a decision or struggling with guilt . Wouldn't you rather them see love than condemnation?
The truth... The reason many don't care is because the truth is given a bad name... Even the most simple mention of the truth bring calls of, no love, hate, condemnation, and judgment...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: RE: - 9/25/2008 6:12:30 PM
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IMA_CHRISTIAN
Posts: 1671
Joined: 1/23/2006
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MY BIG QUESTION IS THIS -
people say "if you vote for obama, you are voting for a pro-abortionist. if you vote for mccain, you are voting for someone who is anti-abortion." and because of those statements, your vote means ONLY that.
if i vote for obama, yes, i will be voting for someone whos views differ than me, but is that all i am voting for? i would be voting for him for all his other qualities and that one has to come along with the whole package unfortunately.
i dont know if im able to express what im trying to say. i mean is that All that obama means? a vote for the murder of the unborn? i mean is that all Obama is to you? is that all mccain is to you - two men with views on unborn babies?
im going to vote for the person who i like - in spite of these two views. I'd liketo get past that issue and vote for the person i like, unfortunately the one i like is also going to have some bad stuff tagged along for the ride.
I absolutely HATE this election.
_____________________________
I'm just one of those Calvinistic robots for the Lord :)
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RE: RE: - 9/25/2008 7:01:23 PM
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LoyalGypsy
Posts: 2457
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: IMA_CHRISTIAN
MY BIG QUESTION IS THIS -
people say "if you vote for obama, you are voting for a pro-abortionist. if you vote for mccain, you are voting for someone who is anti-abortion." and because of those statements, your vote means ONLY that.
if i vote for obama, yes, i will be voting for someone whos views differ than me, but is that all i am voting for? i would be voting for him for all his other qualities and that one has to come along with the whole package unfortunately.
i dont know if im able to express what im trying to say. i mean is that All that obama means? a vote for the murder of the unborn? i mean is that all Obama is to you? is that all mccain is to you - two men with views on unborn babies?
im going to vote for the person who i like - in spite of these two views. I'd liketo get past that issue and vote for the person i like, unfortunately the one i like is also going to have some bad stuff tagged along for the ride.
I absolutely HATE this election.
Greetings,
quote:
i mean is that All that obama means? a vote for the murder of the unborn? i mean is that all Obama is to you? is that all mccain is to you - two men with views on unborn babies?
When wieghed against the Word of God it has nothing to do with me, my and I personal preferences, because if was killed off as an abortion... I wouldnt be here typing this.
But then again if I survived; and if Oboma has his way... I would be killed anyway.
quote:
unfortunately the one i like is also going to have some bad stuff tagged along for the ride.
Unfortunate for who?
LG
_____________________________
Ex 19:5 Now therefore, if you will indeed obey My voice
...So the Persians ask that the 300 drop their arms. Leonidas responds; "Persians! Come and get them!"
300 The Movie
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RE: RE: - 9/25/2008 7:17:07 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 5511
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: IMA_CHRISTIAN
MY BIG QUESTION IS THIS -
people say "if you vote for obama, you are voting for a pro-abortionist. if you vote for mccain, you are voting for someone who is anti-abortion." and because of those statements, your vote means ONLY that.
if i vote for obama, yes, i will be voting for someone whos views differ than me, but is that all i am voting for? i would be voting for him for all his other qualities and that one has to come along with the whole package unfortunately.
i dont know if im able to express what im trying to say. i mean is that All that obama means? a vote for the murder of the unborn? i mean is that all Obama is to you? is that all mccain is to you - two men with views on unborn babies?
im going to vote for the person who i like - in spite of these two views. I'd liketo get past that issue and vote for the person i like, unfortunately the one i like is also going to have some bad stuff tagged along for the ride.
I absolutely HATE this election.
If you can find a way to vote for a candidate and somehow parcel that vote in that it only lends support to those things you believe are good and or worthy of your support let me know... I haven't figure it out yet...
As it stands a vote for Obama will lend support to the murder of 3500 unborn children daily and the homosexual agenda...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 29:12 If a ruler hearken to lies, all his servants are wicked.
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RE: RE: - 9/26/2008 12:09:42 AM
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1970rodney
Posts: 1524
Joined: 5/1/2008
Status: offline
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I didn't know real Christians could be baby killers?
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I started out with nothing and still have most of it!
I don't have to go to Church, I get to!
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RE: RE: - 9/26/2008 12:06:16 PM
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ljmac
Posts: 1375
Joined: 11/20/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: IMA_CHRISTIAN
MY BIG QUESTION IS THIS -
people say "if you vote for obama, you are voting for a pro-abortionist. if you vote for mccain, you are voting for someone who is anti-abortion." and because of those statements, your vote means ONLY that.
if i vote for obama, yes, i will be voting for someone whos views differ than me, but is that all i am voting for? i would be voting for him for all his other qualities and that one has to come along with the whole package unfortunately.
i dont know if im able to express what im trying to say. i mean is that All that obama means? a vote for the murder of the unborn? i mean is that all Obama is to you? is that all mccain is to you - two men with views on unborn babies?
im going to vote for the person who i like - in spite of these two views. I'd liketo get past that issue and vote for the person i like, unfortunately the one i like is also going to have some bad stuff tagged along for the ride.
I absolutely HATE this election.
This election is no different than any since Gerald Ford ran. Every Republican candidate since has been pro-life and every Democrat since has been pro-abortion.
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RE: RE: - 9/26/2008 4:39:48 PM
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IMA_CHRISTIAN
Posts: 1671
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline
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whomever i vote for im going to hate. you see how the economy is bad in the USA, with this $700 billion bailout.
and theres the war which i hate and all the money going into something that probably will never realy end until jesus comes back.
someone said that the president is not the one who is in charge of changing Roe v wade, its congress or the senate or the house or something like that. so if the president is not in charge of that, why should mccain be nominated just coz he is anti-abortion if he really cant change it.
anyway, bush has been president for the past 8 years, roe v wade has not been overturned. bush is anti-abortion,, what good did it do? so you see even John mccain will serve 4 years and we will still have abortion being legal.
I dont have much hope for any of them to make any difference anyway whatsoever.
i also believe God is going to put in who God wants. he may give us a Pharaoh but it would be for some good to us, or it could be God's judgment, either way, God will decide.
if i vote for obama, im not voting for abortion as it is already legal on the books, its not moral but its legal. its already here. we can thank Planned Parenthood humanism on much of it being legal.
the gay thing - obama is for gay rights, but we already have gay peopel here, and we already have gay people making inroads, so no matter if obama or mccain gets elected, life goes on in that respect. Gay people will not magically disappear if mccain gets elected.
i just dont have hope in either. I dont believe in man. I dont have confidence in any man to change things. i just trust God. In fact, if obama gets elected, God can made Obama do whatever God wants.
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I'm just one of those Calvinistic robots for the Lord :)
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